Audience behaviour

[J.Z. Herrenberg]

Standing ovations are frequent at concerts in Holland (certainly in Amsterdam), and they can go on for quite some time. There isn't that much of a rush to get out of the hall at the end as your concert ticket is valid on the tram or bus for your trip home! Then there is the free wine offered at the interval! Of course on top of all these extras you have the Concertgebouw Orchestra or the excellent Netherlands Philharmonic Orchestra playing. I rarely go home disappointed! Whether things will stay like this with the current govt cutting funding left right and centre we'll have to wait and see.

The first time I attended a concert at the Concertgebouw was in the 1970s. Standing ovations became de rigueur from the 'eighties onwards, even when the concert was mediocre. I always remained seated whilst applauding, but as so many people stood up before me, they blocked my view and I had to stand up, too...

I was at the Proms Gothic, too. The unending (standing) ovation was wholly deserved.

P.S. Dundonnell's remark about the geriatric audience in The Hague is correct. 

[Amphissa]

During the past couple of years, in addition to concerts locally, I've attended orchestral concerts, chamber music and recitals, and/or opera performances in NY city, Chicago, Minneapolis, San Francisco, Boston and Atlanta. It is common to see people wearing casual as well as more dressy clothes. I don't really care what they wear. I always wear a jacket, but not always a tie these days. The exception is the Metropolitan Opera. I do not remember ever seeing anyone in casual dress at the Met and I would feel very conspicuous dressed-down there.

I too share the distaste for over-enthusiastic ovations accorded rather ordinary performances. One does feel odd, remaining seated, when surrounded by a standing crowd gushing over a routine run-through of a tired old warhorse. But I admit, over the years I have sometimes stood just to stretch my legs and prepare to leave after a tiresome concert, as I have long legs and am invariably cramped by the seating in these halls.

My most humorous and also distressing experience in this regard was a Saturday matinee performance in NY a few years ago. The first segment of the program was a positively abominable performance of Beethoven's first piano concerto by that showman, Lang Lang. I had to close my eyes during the performance in order to keep from bursting out laughing at his incessant swooning, swaying, and limpid star gazing. These days, a 12 year old student could perform it as well. But the hall was filled with elderly matrons, and the sea of blue hair rose as a wave following his performance, and then an exodus began as they filled the aisles. The crowd that remained for the Bruckner 9 was treated to a performance of surpassing excellence that deserved the standing ovation. Yet even then, many in the crowd began their exit immediately.

As for Thielemann's antic, I'd have got up and left. But actually, I would not have attended to begin with. Having sat through one concert in which he led the NYPO, I'll never do so again. What an unbearable a$$.

And as to Bartok, he now seems to be among the most played composers in the U.S. Every orchestra I keep track of now seems to include Bartok pieces on several programs each year.

I've often wondered about what will be required for classical music to survive in the concert hall. The sacred traditions of silent reverence by elderly listeners sitting placidly in a theater-like setting, while a group of musicians, all dressed alike in black formal wear, with ritualized arrival of the concert master, the tuning, the arrival of the conductor, the performance of musicians who show no emotion and barely move and never speak, singers and soloists often drowned out by the orchestra or sound levels so low as to be somnambulant  ....

It is all quite archaic and pretentious.

And it is no wonder that it is a dying art form, as it refuses to evolve to engage the interest of today's listeners. Which is very sad, because there is much in classical music that could be enjoyed by all. But by forcing them to conform to ancient stylized rituals and deadening performance practices, it actively shuns newcomers.

[semloh]

The sacred traditions of silent reverence by elderly listeners sitting placidly in a theater-like setting, while a group of musicians, all dressed alike in black formal wear, with ritualized arrival of the concert master, the tuning, the arrival of the conductor, the performance of musicians who show no emotion and barely move and never speak, singers and soloists often drowned out by the orchestra or sound levels so low as to be somnambulant  ....

It is all quite archaic and pretentious.

And it is no wonder that it is a dying art form, as it refuses to evolve to engage the interest of today's listeners. Which is very sad, because there is much in classical music that could be enjoyed by all. But by forcing them to conform to ancient stylized rituals and deadening performance practices, it actively shuns newcomers.

I am sure that if audiences want change, it will happen, but not eveyone among the younger generation wants to overturn tradition. It has its place - we are surrounded by it - by rituals, sacred and otherwise, archaic and emerging. Here in Aus., European traditions are generally enthusiastically embraced by young people, and not just those with European backgrounds but also by those with Asian backgrounds. I am very optimistic about the future of classical music, and especially live concerts.... but I am concerned by the soundbite approach and the concentration on a handful of composers/compositions.

[semloh]

Here's a interesting observation about audience behaviour.....

When the VPO visited Australia recently, their Sydney concert was relayed to large screens in towns across Queensland, subsidized by the state government. Here in the (so-called red-neck) far north, the venue was packed out, the audience came in their normal concert-going attire, were silent at the usual times, applauded at the usual times, and even gave the screen a standing ovation at the end!   

Respect for convention is alive and well!

[Dundonnell]

As a former schoolmaster with a number of (now approaching middle-aged  ) friends who are, in many cases, former pupils of mine I have sought over the years to encourage some at least of them to accompany me to an orchestral concert to experience the glories and delights of an orchestra in full flow

A couple of years ago I persuaded two of these friends to attend a concert in the Berwaldhallen in Stockholm given by the Swedish Radio Symphony Orchestra under Daniel Harding. The concert ended with a really super rendering of the Mahler 1st and, to my relief, the horn section did rise to their collective feet towards the close of the finale as I had assured my friends they would

The Swedes go in for smart, casual attire and a gratifying number in the audience were obviously music students from local conservatories. Very few in the audience wore ties-the Swedes, in the main, eschew that item of 'clothing'. My friends were more casually dressed than I but that was what obviously made them comfortable and if we are to encourage younger people to attend formal orchestral concerts then that is maybe just what we older folk have to accept.

I repeat....I would much rather see young people at a concert than the elderly ladies and gentlemen who are there-in some cases at least-because it is part of the "socially accepted" norm.

[mbhaub]

Where will all this lead? If live classical music is struggling, I would hope that somehow orchestras and opera companies will take the lead of the VPO in Austrialia and the Met Opera and do something that is technologically now feasable: live feeds into our homes. If I could subscribe to the London Symphony concerts, or the Vienna State Opera, or the Berlin Philharmonic and have the concerts fed to me in HD video with 5.1 surround sound, I'd pay for it -- it'd sure save the cost of going there,  I wouldn't have to dress up, there would be no talkers to annoy me. And I could pause between movements and grab another beer! Would enough people sign up to make it profitable? Who knows. But at a local theatre when the Met is broadcast, they sell out quickly.

[semloh]

Where will all this lead? If live classical music is struggling, I would hope that somehow orchestras and opera companies will take the lead of the VPO in Austrialia and the Met Opera and do something that is technologically now feasable: live feeds into our homes. ..........

Interesting idea! I suppose it will happen, although it is a shame because staying at home rather than socializing is yet another nail in the coffin of our sense of community. I recall all those exciting trips to the picture house when I was little, and all the mayhem and fun we all had at the children's film, throwing stuff around, booing the baddies, and cheering the goodies, and being told to behave by the usher  - hardly the same as sitting alone in the usual seat in front of the telly!

But I take your point - it would be very handy for those people who can't get out to a live concert.   

[Jimfin]

I think there are already a lot of people who seldom or never go to a concert, but who love the music. And certain composers are largely only heard on CD or other recorded music, such as Bax or Stanford, concerts of whose music are very rare, though much of their output is recorded.

[Ilja]

Where will all this lead? If live classical music is struggling, I would hope that somehow orchestras and opera companies will take the lead of the VPO in Austrialia and the Met Opera and do something that is technologically now feasable: live feeds into our homes. If I could subscribe to the London Symphony concerts, or the Vienna State Opera, or the Berlin Philharmonic and have the concerts fed to me in HD video with 5.1 surround sound, I'd pay for it -- it'd sure save the cost of going there,  I wouldn't have to dress up, there would be no talkers to annoy me. And I could pause between movements and grab another beer! Would enough people sign up to make it profitable? Who knows. But at a local theatre when the Met is broadcast, they sell out quickly.

I think the Berlin Philharmonic already does this, albeit not with every single concert.

[eschiss1]

I don't know if the Boston Symphony live feeds, but at least some of their concerts are available soon after, I think, not just as radio broadcasts but as replayable videos on wgbh.org (I found a link to a video of their recent concert of their performance of Harbison's 4th symphony at the station's website) - being able to rehear works like that at one's convenience, in an orchestra-authorized fashion at that, is a good thing too... though rather a digression to mention (sorry. Thought it was more connected when I started)

[dafrieze]

The BSO does broadcast live every Saturday night (if the orchestra isn't playing, they usually play recordings of the orchestra).  Here's the website:  http://www.wgbh.org/995/bso.cfm.

[Dundonnell]

I don't know if the Boston Symphony live feeds, but at least some of their concerts are available soon after, I think, not just as radio broadcasts but as replayable videos on wgbh.org (I found a link to a video of their recent concert of their performance of Harbison's 4th symphony at the station's website) - being able to rehear works like that at one's convenience, in an orchestra-authorized fashion at that, is a good thing too... though rather a digression to mention (sorry. Thought it was more connected when I started)

John Harbison has written a Fourth Symphony.....oh, and a Fifth too apparently

That's the trouble with lists: no sooner do they get shorter than they start to expand again...........

[Mark Thomas]

His Sixth, a commission from the BSO, will be premièred at the end of their cycle of performances of his symphonies.

[Dundonnell]

His Sixth, a commission from the BSO, will be premièred at the end of their cycle of performances of his symphonies.

Oh....good

[jerfilm]

Pursuant to a bit of our earlier discussion, some of you will probably find this story very sad albeit a bit amusing.   Guess this just happened....

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/classicalmusic/2012/01/alan_gilbert_stops_ny_philharm.html

Jerry