Unknown Violin Concerto... Please help...

[matesic]

What a monster! From the orchestral sound I'd say you must be in the right part of the world, but it certainly isn't one of the Taktakishvili concerti posted on youtube. The heroic solo playing could be a clue.

[This refers to this post in the Downloads Board - Mark]

[Holger]

Hello,

I don't know whether this is the right place to answer to the question about the unknown violin concerto from the Downloads Section. In any case, I can confirm that the concerto in question is definitely Taktakishvili's Violin Concerto No. 1 in F Minor from 1976 after all. The only issue is that for some reason, the order of the movements is reversed in this version (probably an error by somebody who joined different files): first the finale is heard, then the third movement, then the second one (a brief scherzo) and the last movement in this recording is in fact the first movement of the concerto.

Hope to have helped.

Regards,
Holger

[Alan Howe]

Phew, glad that's solved.

I've merged the two threads.

[semloh]

Oh, well done, Holger!   It's a very enjoyable work, I think.

The Taktakishvili was the first one I checked, but it never crossed my mind that the order of movements had been changed and so I wasted an hour or so continuing to check the opening against all my other VCs! 

[matesic]

Taktakishvili's work indeed, but isn't it the youtube version that puts the movements in the wrong order? Blaine's version starts with a very "first movementish" Walton/Barberesque theme which recurs throughout the movement and at the end of the piece where it makes a satisfying apotheosis. The scherzo occurs second, as described in the composers list of works on wikipedia. The way the youtube version opens actually sounds more like a central slow movement to me; I haven't yet listened to it all, but the piece certainly merits repeated hearings.

[matesic]

Actually I think there must be distinct versions of the same piece. There are two recordings on youtube that both place the movements in a different order from Blaine's version. My confusion isn't helped by the rather odd performance of the dropbox file if you try to stream it rather than downloading.

[ken]

There was a recording of Taktakishvili's Violin Concerto issued on Melodiya LP 33C10-10115,6 with the Moscow Radio Symphony Orchestra conducted by the composer.  The violinist was Liana Isakadze.

[ken]

The track listing from the Melodiya LP are as follows:

1.  Andante 9:56
2.  Presto Leggiero 2:59
3.  Moderato Cantabile  7:38
4.  Finale:  Allegro  10:16

[Holger]

In fact, I must admit I do not really understand the problem. I know this piece for maybe ten years or even more, I have the original Melodiya LP in my collection and there can be no doubt about the order of the movements. I have just tried one of the YouTube versions (which I personally didn't check before – admittedly I am often a bit uncomfortable about the sound quality of all these YouTube videos) and all is right there. The work in fact starts with a kind of slow introduction, a dialogue between violin and clarinet. The actual first movement is then an allegro in F Minor. Then we have the scherzo and the slow movement. The whole work is characterized by a mood of plaint and sorrow, and the finale is no exception indeed. However the final minutes do serve as a sort of climax, the overall mood turns more agitated and the last bars then more and more move on to F Major, which leads to a kind of solution of the work's "inner conflict" if you want.

I guess the version Blaine posted seems to come from classical-music-online.net (or at least it can also be heard there). Note that on that particular site, multi-movement pieces are usually presented as one file even if the source originally consisted of several tracks. I assume that in case of the Taktakishvili concerto, the files were just joined in the wrong order.

I cannot find any trace about a potentially different version. I know this work pretty well, and even if I did not play Blaine's version in total all I heard perfectly corresponded to what I knew before. I also don't think a reverse order of the work's movements would make sense with respect to the work's "drama" / development.

This discussion put aside, I consider the work to be a great concerto, certainly a favourite of mine.

[semloh]

I thought it was almost unique for a violin concerto to begin with an andante but, having checked, I see that the concerto by Von Einem, Prokofiev's 1st, Bartok's 1st, and the fine concerto by Różycki each begin with an andante. That's just the one's I picked up quickly, so maybe not so unusual after all.

Just as an aside, I see that Taktakishvili also started his neo-romantic 2nd Symphony with a beautiful andante movement. It's a strategy that seems to work well, as long as it captivates the listener!

[JimL]

Unusual for a violin concerto to begin with an andante?  When Bruch started his 2nd VC with an adagio (ma non troppo), Brahms thought it should be made illegal!

[eschiss1]

How many of them begin with Andantes and how many with Andante - Allegros though? Movement headers will often just list the introductions. The Prokofiev is primarily slow with occasional outbursts, but...

(Re Taktakishvili 2, well, that harks back to the sonata da chiesa, too, I suppose.)

Edit: Jaques-Dalcroze' 2nd concerto (1909) (recorded, but I'm going by IMSLP) seems to have 2 movements the first of which is a Dal largo doloroso al doloroso appassionato.

[matesic]

I guess it's more unusual to end with a quiet andante as in Blaine's version, but I think it works! In this order the opening movement with its insidious theme is very effective too, although perhaps too reminiscent of earlier 20th century models. Rather than a mistake, maybe someone's creative reconstruction?

[eschiss1]

Not unknown, of course- EJ Moeran's fine violin concerto ends with a Lento (and if I recall, a movement primarily slow, not just marked Lento, but I may have to doublecheck that)- but you are right that it's more unusual.

[Alan Howe]

New member Tetsugakusha75 replies:

Hello Blaine!

Your question about that unknown violin concerto made me curious, hearing that beautiful music made me try my luck, and I had some luck! So I can confirm you it IS Taktakishvili's first violin concerto, though the order of the movements is reversed: Movement I starts at 21'10'', II at 18'07'', III at 10'23'', IV at 0'01'''. Liana Isakadze is playing the violin, the conductor is Taktakishvili himself.

Thank you for revealing this beautiful concerto to me in such an entertaining way :-)

Best regards from Germany,
Thorsten