Steinberg Symphony 4 & VC from Dutton

[Ilja]

Some music deserves its obscurity, but thank God for recordings so that I can make that determination for myself.

That, I think is the key and the essence of this forum (at least for me): you can relegate music to obscurity as far as you yourself are concerned, but never for other people. Everyone needs to make those choices for themselves, and self-proclaimed authorities who condemn music to the garbage bin of history on everyone's behalf need to be treated with extreme scepticism.



For instance, I'm quite fond of Grechaninov's later works since to me the earliest two seems to be caught in somewhat generic Russian forms.

[eschiss1]

That said, I asked a question that I haven't heard an answer to yet.

Alan wrote here a few posts ago

"I wonder just who thought Steinberg's 4th was worth resurrecting."

Well, quite a few posters on this forum (I don't recall expressing an opinion one way or the other, but quite a few) who listened to the truncated upload of an older recording (lacking the first movement?) of Steinberg's 4th or a work claiming to be this and who asked for a commercial recording of same, iirc, since one asks? So it does seem "we giveth and we taketh away" from Dutton's POV, in a manner of speaking

My question was simply (and without ulterior motive/assumptions, vested whatevers) is this upload (also on YouTube) the same work as on the new CD, or is the former another work misidentified as Steinberg 4? (As often happens.)

[Mark Thomas]

That's an intriguing thought, Eric. Anyone able to answer the question?

[MartinH]

Is Steinberg's 4th worth resurrecting? Absolutely, positively yes! Like a lot of other forgotten and neglected music it probably won't be making the rounds in concert halls, but I am grateful for the chance to have at least heard it. Now I hope symphonies 3 & 5 show up. The question is why someone would bother to take the time to locate scores and parts, hire an orchestra, finance a recording and all the other complex details that go into making a recording. I suppose that most record producers are dedicated to music, who want to give music at least a hearing. And not go to all that work for another recording of the Beethoven 9th, Dvorak New World, Tchaikovsky Pathetique and so on. Compare it to books: there are an awful lot of classics and other old books that maybe few people read, but they're being digitized and preserved and if I want to read Ivanhoe, I can. Music is similar with one obvious difference: it must be performed and heard to be consumed. Not everyone can read a score and hear it internally.

The supply of unrecorded music must be profound - likely more of it than stuff that has been recorded. Most of it probably not very good, interesting, or worth spending much time on. 50 years ago there was much less music of the neglected composers available. When I was starting to buy CDs in the 80's, I never imagined that within a couple of decades I would have access to the works of Rubinstein, Raff, Schmidt, Bax, Arnell, Stanford, Parry, Rontgen, Petersen-Berger, Simpson, Atterberg, Juon, Vladigerov...it's unending and it's been a real delight to have been able to hear what these guys wrote! So now it's Steinberg's turn, maybe. Who knows where it will lead and what other wonderful music is languishing on the shelves in Moscow or St. Petersburg?

[eschiss1]

and Ropartz who was mentioned in another connection  here - another composer I only knew from a few recordings, a few off-air broadcasts (symphony 5 under Slatkin), and a MIDI I enjoyed making (the very lovely- I thought, but definitely of its time for those who care more - last of his quartets). Now each of those works -are- recorded (thanks, in this case, to Timpani.)

Or similarly Widor (thanks to Dutton and Hyperion, for the piano concertos, to Dutton for the cello concerto and first two symphonies, only one of which I'd heard (from broadcast)- etc.)

Now Steinberg's A major (first) string quartet _is_ very promising (in my opinion, judging from Matesic's upload on IMSLP), (and I'm still curious about his later 2nd quartet!) (And considering too that Steinberg worked with Rimsky's and others' late works, completing music and orchestration manuals, the influence of Rimsky can't have totally stopped in 1908, I think. Though I rather hope certain problems I have with what I've read of the Rimsky manual _are_ Steinberg's fault )

[Alan Howe]

...and when all's said and done, Steinberg's 4th is still a poor piece. IMHO, of course. I suppose part of the frustration I feel is that I'm sure there is more important music out there, waiting to be recorded. For example, Chris Fifield has identified Julius Otto Grimm's Symphony in D minor as a vital piece in the puzzle which led to the composition of Brahms' 1st Symphony. And there's still no sign of a recording of Wilhelm Berger's superlative 2nd Symphony. So, while I'm glad to have had the opportunity of hearing Steinberg's 4th, you'll have to excuse my feeling that a lot of effort was expended on a pretty vacuous piece. IMHO.

[Christopher]

I think the main thing is that discussion happens.  I don't particularly care if the appraisal of a piece of music is favourable or not, and I take it as obvious that any view is no more than the opinion of the writer, not an instruction!   I love logging on and seeing that there is a whole bunch of new contribution. It is almost always informative. And it compares really well with some classical music forums which, while having their own pluses, are largely silent on the discussion front.

[Alan Howe]

You are right, Christopher. Sensible, measured and reasoned discussion is what's needed everywhere on the internet instead of the exchange of personal insults and the taking of offence when someone happens to disagree with a view that's been expressed. We hope that this will continue here at UC.