Fritz Brun - copyright issues

[adriano]

A reply to eschiss1 - to his first posting of this thread

The Swiss composer's copyright company (SUISA) just write me that, if one wants to reproduce a printed score by Fritz Brun on the IMSLP page, he must ask permssion to the publisher (Hug Musikerlage, Zürich) - otherwise it would be an infringment of "graphic rights".

[Double-A]

Of course this shows how hopelessly complicated intellectual property law has become.  The "graphic rights" I assume  belong to Hug, not to Brun's estate.  Imagine IMSLP got its hands on a photocopy of Brun's autograph.  Could they post that in Canada?  Or would Brun's estate also own graphic rights?

There is the other question:  If the work got posted in Canada would it be worth the effort for Hug to sue?  I doubt very much.  So what is the point of those graphic rights?

[der79sebas]

@ Alan Howe: Thanks for the clarification!

[adriano]

Frankly, DoubleA (and eschiss1), this should be enquired directly by the parties who want to upload. I am not here for that too. I am an artist and not a copyright enquiries bureau. I've given enough info already to help.

[Alan Howe]

I think perhaps we've gone as far as we can with this topic.

I'll end on a personal note. A decade or so ago I encountered the music of Rufinatscha - and forged a close working relationship with the Tyrolean State Museums in Innbruck who sold (and still sell) wonderful recordings of his music. And what did I then find? That the member now banned from this site had uploaded some of these precious recordings for any cheapskate Tom, Dick or Harry to download free of charge - without any consideration of the effort and cost that had gone into their production.

No wonder Adriano feels so strongly about all this. It's his living, after all...

[adriano]

I wish it were, Alan...
But not even with my low conducting fees - and many recordings condcuted fro free - I would have been able to live. My job at the Zurich Opera kept me up. Now I have to survive on a not all too exciting pension - in this extremely expensive country of mine. And, dont't forget, I never was given a cent of royalties for my 30 Marco Polo/Naxos CDs. Small royalty precentages coming from Guild were passed on to the Brun Estate and from the two last Sterling CDs, will go to the sponsors. But these are sums in the range of less that 80 Euro per year...
To me this copyright problem is mainly a matter of principle and respect toward artists and musicians.

[Double-A]

I am sorry, Hadrianus.  My questions were meant entirely rhetorical/sarcastic.  I think we can all agree that the law as presently on the books and as presently enforced is far from optimal.

[adriano]

Right, Double-A .-)
Brun's autographs are definitely deposited all over here in Switzerland, either at the Paul Sacher Foundation or with the Brun Estate (deposited at the Zurich Central Library). Two separate works are in Berne Archives. That's easy to take under control, since he did not write much music.
As you see, also those autograph's rights are clearly defined. And, if IMSLP would want to reproduce a photocopy of an autograph, they would have to ask the Estate first. From the Sacher museum fridge one does not get anything for sure!
But I doubt whether MS copies in the net will be possible as long as Brun is protected. I have "safety" PDF copies of all orchestral and chamber works - scores and autographs - and work on a detailed catalogue. The Estate fully trusts me also in my function as a controller of all work's sources.
The problem with Brun is that most of his works are in autograph form; only his Symphonies 3-5 have been printed, besides some songs and chamber works *). So, in case another conductor would want to perform an unprinted Symphony, he would have to do this from an autograph's copy - like I did. Bruns publisher (Hug Musikverlage) was alarmed at Bruns stylistic development after the 2nd Symphony, so after the 4th, they did not want to continue the series.
Piano scores of the Piano and Cello Concerto, of his Variations for strings and piano - and the two work for choir and orchestra are available in new editions prepared by myself - as the scores (and parts) of the Festive Overture and of the mentioned Variations.

*) New editions of Brun's two Violin Sonatas are available for sale from Amadeus Verlag, Winterthur.
http://www.amadeusmusic.ch/itemlist.php?qsa=|||143|||

[Greg K]

Quite by happenstance I listened to the entire Brun Cello Concerto on YouTube a day after it was posted there and liked it so much I immediately purchased the CD.  This is a good thing, no?  Had I not been able to hear the music (not just a sample but the whole piece) there is no way I would risk $20 on the completely unknown.  What I describe has been duplicated dozens of times by me, and all to the financial renumeration of the composers, artists, and record labels Adriano advocates for.  Isn't this the bright side of a phenomenon everyone here seems to unqualifiedly castigate? 

[FBerwald]

But what if you didn't like it and therefore didn't purchase it? Listening to sample clips is different from listening to the whole piece. You dont buy a shirt and wear it a function and then decide to purchase it because you liked it.   

[adriano]

Right so, FBerwald!
Greg K sounds honest to me, but he is certainly a rare case :-)

Nothing against the possibility of listening to a work online before buying a CD, but this should be possible only by paying a small fee - in favour, at least, to a still copyrighted composer. YouTube too should set up something like this.
To be fully protected as a performer/artist I have given up hopes since a long time... 

In the worst of cases, one could go to a library.
Over here we have an online collection of all CDs figuring in the State Phonographic Archive. My complete Discography looks, for example, like this:
https://www.fonoteca.ch/cgi-bin/oecgi4.exe/inet_fnbasephononamedetail?NAME_ID=36705.011&LNG_ID=DEU
(klick on "Alle Dokumente"). This list also includes some recordings by other conductors which I have restored.

So, one can go to a public library, click and listen to those audio files (without copying them, of course).
Some CD shops still have listening devices. One also can read reviews or listen to Radio.
I must admit that sound samples are of no good help - and can be totally misleading.

As far as buying music is concerned: The greatest part of recordings of my huge collection were bought blindly, rarely by listening to sound samples - or upon recommendation - or after reading biographies.
Music is worth taking risks, as any other art form, including cinema.
I bought my complete Proust, Dickens, Chechov and Dostojewski without even knowing a passage; just because I was curious and had heard that it's great :-)

As far as the Brun Cello Concerto is concerned, my liner notes can be read in the free online 164-page Booklet on Brilliant's Website. This could also be considered a recommendation :-)
https://www.brilliantclassics.com/media/1621710/95784-brun-booklet-download-file.pdf

[jdperdrix]

Or subscribe to a free account with spotify... Brun's complete orchestral works can be streamed with a decent quality (mp3-128), which is much better than samples. Then decide if you want to buy the CDs or download with a higher quality...

[adriano]

Exactly, jdperdrix :-)
I hope the new control laws against YouTube are being soon taken over by other countries as well. Germany just started a week ago.

[Alan Howe]

Music is worth taking risks

Quite right!

[UnsungMasterpieces]

My copy of the Fritz Brun boxset arrived today, and I've almost finished the first disc.
So far I'm finding the music very enjoyable.