Would you recommend this CD collection?

[tcutler]

Brilliant Classic's Golden Age of the Romantic Piano

http://brilliantclassics.com/release.aspx?id=FM00000347

Are these recordings worth getting, or am I better off paying more for CDs from Hyperion's Piano Concerto series?

[thalbergmad]

There are many concerti on that Brilliant release that have not been recorded by Hyperion.

Recording quality is not as good in general, but none on Hyperion were played by Ponti, so that kinds of even things up.

At the price, you can't really go wrong.

Thal

[JimL]

Even Ponti can't make up for the fact that cuts (anywhere from judicious to massive) were made in many of the concertos (e.g. the opening tuttis of Moscheles 3 and Kalkbrenner 1, the finale of Goetz 2).  And the engineering, and often the orchestral support itself, is often wanting in comparison to Hyperion.  So, if "brilliant" pianism is what you're after, these may be your cup of tea, but if the possessing the urtext is your aim, you might just want to wait and hope that Hyperion gets around to recording everything that Vox did thirty to forty years ago

[Steve B]

Tcutler, if you like Ponti(and i seem to remember you do:)!) GO FOR IT. IT IS FANTASTIC. Never mind the poor Vox orchestras, some of which are better than others anyway, and the few cuts(though Jim will always warn of these ), the pianism is electrifying and beats the staid old Hyperion roster hands-down for barnstorming AND delicacy. The Ponti are very fast tempi but for power AND sensitivity(and some sheer zaniness:)!) u can't go wrong. Every concerto he plays is brought to life, as  opposed to the almost indistinguishable styles of the Hyperion group. But, as I am sure you realise, there are the Ponti-ites and the non-Ponti-ites on this site. So buy, listen and tell me what you think. There are also some rareities played by others:Beach's, Lalo PCs, for instance; the only complaint is the Tchaik cd; u are in for a surprise(but the correct Tchaik is available on a Vox Box). I have discovered, around the internet(including, surprisingly, one young guy on FACEBOOK-sic!) that there are more Ponti appreciators and fans than I thought, which is nice, cos he has many detractors. His playing is actually more technically accurate than Horowitz's and more emotionally tuned in, if you like wild, emotionally unfettered pianism. And, as Jim, says the ur-texts can be obtained anywhere these days.
If you buy it,cutler , would love to hear ur opinions via private message on this or email:"stev_arts@yahoo.co.uk"

[thalbergmad]

I bought it this time last year my friend. I was just trying to convince tcutler.

For sure, I am a Ponti - ite. I much prefer his playing to the Midi's sometimes produced by Hamelin.

Thal

[Alan Howe]

I'd recommend it - but not as a sole purchase. The orchestras and recordings just aren't up to Hyperion standards. Nevertheles, it's a steal.

[Steve B]

Sorry, Thal. Meant to address my reply to T Cutler! I remember now you are a Ponti-ite:)Steve

[FBerwald]

For sure, I am a Ponti - ite. I much prefer his playing to the Midi's sometimes produced by Hamelin.

                YIPEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!   
 
But I agree the Ponti-spirit more than makes up for the Orchestra!

[Steve B]

YIPPEEEEEEEE INDEED, bERWALD. U like Ponti's Berwald PC? How mad is it? The performance suits a mad, zany beautiful concerto(even more zany passage -work than Field's concerti and they are pretty "overthetop"!)And the speed; and delicacy in those immensely (rhythmically) complicated roulades. Some of it makes me smile "out loud". I compared Greta Eriksson's staid "offering"; boring, slow , unscintillating(and the concerto is the very essence of beautiful scintillation)-almost as if playing something else. What r ur favourite Ponti's, Berwald.? i have some pretty obscure stuff; including Liszt Transcendental Etudes; NEWER (Dante) Raff/Moszkowski recordings and the most exciting, moving Rach 3 ever(very rare, cos Dante went bust straight afterwards, probably Ponti's last commercial recording), with a GOOD orchestra, well recorded; and some of the Dante live solo recordings, though the later ones are, again, almost unobtainable, if indeed some were ever issued.(eg Ponti playing Horowitz's piano:)!) Never ever seen this one on the net.i even have his autograph on a Marco polo cd!Steve

[FBerwald]

Dear Steve, Must confess I investigated Ponti after coming across his name in the (Good Old Raff [sniff] forum!!!) and came across his version of Henselt. Now I had heard this concerto done my Midi-Master-Mark and hadn't thought much of it...infact i seem to remember thinking what all the fuss was about. Then after Ponti I was like "LORD please forgive me ....I have erred " . The fact that His playing was so good that I didn't mind the horrible orchestra convinced me I was listening to a master. When I listened to his Henselt it was like listening to Beethovan's 4th (my fav.!!!) all goose pimples and wonder!!!!!!
  I haven't heard much of Ponti but the little I have I treasure. I love his Raff concerto. I also have his Rubinstein 4th the beginning (about 1 minute or so) of the 3rd movement has been cut off so its sounds odd (anyway here I prefer Banowitz). His Moscheles G minor concerto is very good, Moszkowski (absolutely Yummy!). I have yet to hear his Field but I'm sure its mind blowing. Ponti is one or the few artists who don't disappoint me, a pianist who,even if he doesn't shine in every record,  doesn't ruin the music with senseless rubato, cheap sentiments or Most importantly and over inflated EGO!!! I classify him with Murray Perahia, Radu Lupu, Andras Schiff, Angela Hewitt  to name a few.
  As for Berwald, from the 1st time I listened to his 'Singulare' symphony I have learned NOT to pigeonhole him . I find his Piano concerto most representative of his art. Quirky, unpredictable, amusing. Id love to look at the score It must be brimming with notes. (there seem to be so many!!!!!!!!!) The 1st movement seems to have a lot of rapid passagework!!! The 3rd movement is rightly compared to Schumann for its Humour and agility!

[Steve B]

Berwald, afraid Ponti didnt record Field; wish he had.

As regards your comments on WHAT you like in Ponti, because, in  particular, he avoids "senseless rubato" and "overinflated ego", isnt is strange how we experience music (and therefore interpretation)DIFFERENTLY?!:): To my ears, Ponti uses LARGE amounts of rubato of the Paderewski-esque type(ie. going with the  OVERALL ebb and flow of the music, not the limited type where you can make some notes longer/shorter but you must even out,over the bar as a totality, the number of beats in each individual bar). Extreme examples would be the Scriabin Piano Sonatas he recorded(complete); but also his relentless, but effective-it suits the passionate music- D'Alberts wonderfully exciting, heart-on-sleeve-with no-redundant note Piano Concerto No.2, with its exquisite melodies).I would say he HAS got a LARGE personal and musical ego, which shines through the music; they are sometimes true to the spirit of the piece he is performing, but sometimes re-envisionings of the whole works; his very raison-d'etre is EXTREMES- be it of opulent grandiloquence or delicate sensitivity. The effects of the extreme rubato are a nervile, frenzied, almost manic intensity(which is why his Scriabin is so fiery and nervous). I think how we perceive pianists is very  interesting: remember the Joyce Hatto "affair" and even certain "Gramophone "critics said she played Mozart as idiomatically, to his own  style, as she did Albeniz!. The reason being, of course, it was many pianists. I have even seen Ponti's Scriabin described as "straight" compared to others, allegedly more fiery(!?)renditions. But I am not saying my ear is  better than yours, berwald, or any one else's;just that it is nearly all subjective/personal, and all(reasonable!) views are to be respected. Btw, I LIKE Ponti's rubato heavy, frenzied re-envisionnings!Well, we are all different; glad you like him anyway-thats the main thing.Will listen to some more Berwald, though have never found anything as zany and as characterful as Piano Concerto!Can u recommend, as i have quite a lot of Franz B..On the subject of PERCEIVING interpretations differently, I thought Marc-Andre Hamelin a bit more passionate than some of the Hyperion pianists! Just shows! all individual ears; and I like Piers lane in Paderewski's PC; but then Ponti(sadly)didnt record it.Steve

[FBerwald]

I did say senseless rubato. I also agree Ponti has an ego but when its used to bring out something written in the score rather than what YOU Want in the score, I have no problem. I base this on his version of Henselt.
As for Hamelin.....Here is something you can do. I suggest 4 concertos -
   1. Scharwenka Piano concerto No 1. Earl Wild vs Hemalin.
   2. Henselt Piano concerto Ponti Vs Hemalin.
   3. Rubinstein Piano concerto no 4 Banowetz Vs Hemalin.
   4. Joseph Marx 'Romantic' Piano concerto David Lively Vs Hemalin
Hear them and see what you like best.
Surprisingly I like his Brahms Concerto no 2 on Hyperion but somehow was dissatisfied with the orchestra. I also Love his Medtner.
I would always come back to the Symphonies of Berwald any day. His bassoon concertstuke is beautiful a bit like his piano concerto only more restrained and the wonderful Septet. BY the way  have you heard his Double violin concerto? It's something I don't have.

[eschiss1]

I think the Berwald two-violin concerto's been recorded once on Sterling (has there been another recording?) Haven't yet heard it myself.

[Syrelius]

Will listen to some more Berwald, though have never found anything as zany and as characterful as Piano Concerto!Can u recommend, as i have quite a lot of Franz B..

Hello Steve,

As FBerwald noted, the symphonies is the obvious starting point with Berwald. The Queen of Golconda and Estrella De Soria ouvertures are also well worth watching out for (the version of the later on the Sterling CD does not do the work justice, though), and some of the tone poems are pleasent too, though not in the same league as the symphonies. Of the chamber music I would especially recommend the string quartets and the septet.

[JimL]

I was aware that Berwald had composed an early violin concerto, which I find rather mediocre.  I was totally unaware that there was a two-violin concerto that had been recorded, no less!  Is it a more mature work than the single violin VC?  Also, is it a complete work, or was it finished or orchestrated by other hands?  Somebody give me a link...