Ralph Vaughan Williams - world famous in the UK?

[TerraEpon]

As an American, I find it hard to believe RVW is so unknown in some parts of the world.

[semloh]

I think we have noted in the past that this is not a phenomenon confined to the UK, and that a number of composers are 'world famous' in their own countries. I find it hard to fathom in the case of RVW, given the popularity of the pieces we've mentioned. I wonder if it's because of the leap in the demands placed on the listener, and the diversity and rather less 'friendly' nature of the symphonies - but then I suppose the same could be said of Shostakovich. For me, RVW's 'sound world' is easily recognized and I struggle to understand why one could adore one work but dislike others, but c'est la vie!

[matesic]

My perception is the opposite of semloh's, that with the sole exception of the fourth RVW's symphonies are actually a great deal "friendlier" than contemporary works from Germany, Russia, even France, and few of his works place any great demands on the listener. Maybe it's that nostalgic peacefulness bordering on complacency that obstructs his universal acceptance as one of the greats. I love him.

[eschiss1]

"... from England" also.

[Alan Howe]

I found this article to be a carefully nuanced assessment of VW and his music - it explains a lot:
https://www.sfsymphony.org/Discover-the-Music/Articles-Interviews/Articles/The-Vaughan-Williams-Brand

[matesic]

Thanks for the link Alan. I'd scarcely disagree with a word - just wish I could put them together as well as Rothe does.

But hang on a minute, I do object to the B-word with its commercial marketing connotations. What's wrong with "school"? Ruth Gipps was a happy graduate of that school and used to drag Ursula VW along to some of our concerts with the London Repertoire and Chanticleer Orchestras

[Alan Howe]

Agreed, although it's difficult to find a better word than 'brand'. I think he means 'character' or 'characteristics', rather than 'school'. I might have titled the article 'The Essence of Vaughan Williams' - perhaps, because VW was attempting to create music that was essentially English.

[semloh]

Matesic wrote:

My perception is the opposite of semloh's, that with the sole exception of the fourth RVW's symphonies are actually a great deal "friendlier" than contemporary works from Germany, Russia, even France, and few of his works place any great demands on the listener.

No, I meant only that RVW's symphonies are less friendly than his popular works. As to whether any place great demands on the listener, it all depends on who the listener is! 

[ewk]

When reading this thread and the notion that being only well known in the home country is a phenomenon affecting many composers, I wondered whether this is a phenomenon confined to home countries? I.e. do you know composers that are far better-known abroad or in a specific  country other than their home country, whatever be the reasons? A bit off-topic, of course...

[eschiss1]

That definitely happens outside of music, I see no reason why it shouldn't happen in. (I'm guessing -some- expatriate composers were probably more performed in their new countries than in their old even when they didn't forbid performances in the land of their birth, though not in all cases, though that may not be the sort of case you mean...)

[Mark Thomas]

ewk wrote:

do you know composers that are far better-known abroad or in a specific  country other than their home country

It's an interesting point (and I can certainly think of at least one example), but one for another thread, please. Why not start one?

[chriss]

There is a great "Konzertarchiv" on the Vienna Philharmonic website. Every performance since 1842 is listed

https://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/de/konzert-archiv

There are only a few performances of works by VW. Furtwängler conducted music by him for the first time in 1929
https://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/de/konzerte/3-abonnementkonzert/6456/

Bax for example was performed only once. There was an interesting concert of british music in 1935 conducted by Boult including Job by VW
https://www.wienerphilharmoniker.at/de/konzerte/salzburger-festspiele/6978/

[Alan Howe]

Furtwängler conducted music by him for the first time in 1929

Interesting - even if it was only his Norfolk Rhapsody.

[Wheesht]

On 20 October 1927 Furtwängler conducted the Gewandhausorchester in the following programme:

Gewandhausorchester, Wilhelm Furtwängler Dirigent, Elly Ney Klavier

Ralph Vaughan Williams — Fantasia on a theme by Thomas Tallis
Johannes Brahms — 1. Konzert für Klavier und Orchester d-Moll op. 15
Ludwig van Beethoven — 6. Sinfonie F-Dur op. 68 ("Pastorale").

Ignatz Waghalter conducted the Philharmonisches Orchester Berlin on 1 February 1923 in a programme of Berlioz, Debussy and RVW. The "Konzertführer Berlin-Brandenburg 1920-2012" does not give any details of the works that were played. I'll try if I can find out more from digitised newspapers.

[Alan Howe]

Thanks!