Grimm, Julius Otto - Symphony in D minor Op.19 (1875)

[Alan Howe]

I have just been replaying the first movement of this marvellous symphony: I was particularly thrilled by the passage beginning around 12 minutes in, i.e approx. 90 seconds before the end. What a Luftpause!

[semloh]

That bit gave me goosebumps, Alan! I agree wholeheartedly with the positive responses in this thread. Let's hope it catches the attention of a CD producer.

[Reverie]

Thanks.

Interesting and diverse comments.

I must admit I initially didn't warm to this work as I was looking for more melody. However, as I have said previously, after a few listenings it has revealed more than a few master strokes. I could list these but it would be on the verge of being tedious to do so.

Note spinning at its best

I think this is a bit harsh to be honest. It's a throw away comment with no justification. Works emerging from the classical genre will inevitably have a foundation based on tonic/dominant with associated melodic construction. I think the innovotive moments in this work are the creative development of form and that is evident in each movement if you look for it. It's form that Otto was being driven by. And it's form that later composers developed further.

A few thoughts .....

[MartinH]

"Note spinning at its best" But not at it's worst, ala Rubinstein's lowest moments. In the Grimm, the continual use of sequences gets tiresome quickly. It's common and easy to use technique that lesser composers (and some majors) gave in to. Every movement makes use of it. Kind of like Robert Volkmann, whose symphonies were also widely praised in their day...

[Reverie]

You make it sound like Vivaldi !

     

[Alan Howe]

Actually, it's what Grimm does with what seems like a note-spinning exercise in his finale. I find it tremendously exciting and not at all predictable. And, as for sequences, well there's the finale of Elgar 2 (which some have complained about) - and that has greatness stamped all over it.

[eschiss1]

Sequences have often bothered me - and far better musicians than me - in much better-known works than this (I forget who it was who pointed out that at one point he lumped Brahms with Wagner among overusers of sequences-- but noticed that some of what he thought were sequential passages in Brahms were sequential in the melody only, but made often made very clever shifts in the accompaniment that moved the music along in ways that the sequences didn't. I doubt this is the case with the development passage in Schumann's piano concerto that much annoys me (but I'll check), and maybe not with those in Grimm's symphony*, but.)

*I'll listen to it later today, it's been a busy and stressy week, I apologize. I've been looking forward to it for awhile.

[britishcomposer]

Dear members,
I have just uploaded a recent broadcast of a live performance of this symphony.
Like Fritz Volbach Grimm was important for the city of Münster as a conductor and teacher.
So it was the Sinfonieorchester Münster under Golo Berg which performed the work last December.
According to the WDR website Grimm finished the work in 1871. I could not find any confirmation for this assertion elsewhere but decided to tag it accordingly.

[Alan Howe]

Hi Mathias,

This is wonderful - thanks so much. I can't wait to hear this.

Let's hope one of the enterprising German labels brings this out.

[Mark Thomas]

Wow! What a surprise!

[eschiss1]

Maybe it's mentioned in a letter in  this book "Johannes Brahms im Briefwechsel mit J.O. Grimm", published in 1908.  I have no access to it offhand, unfortunately.

[Alan Howe]

This report describes the Symphony as the work of the 25 year-old Grimm while a student at the Leipzig Conservatory. That would make the date of composition (or at least the date of the work's conception) 1852:
https://www.muensterschezeitung.de/lokales/staedte/muenster/musik-in-faszinierenden-farben-2504967

Together with the last two symphonies of Rufinatscha and the Symphony in C by Kufferath, I think we now have at least four works worthy of admission to the repertoire dating (roughly) from the period between Schumann 4 and Brahms 1, i.e. the so-called 'Dahlhaus Gap'.

[Reverie]

Oh great - at last! Will give this a good listen with the score.

[Alan Howe]

Listening to the Symphony again, it's hard not to be persuaded that this is a major mid-nineteenth century contribution to the genre. It's also hard to disagree with Chris Fifield's contention that Grimm had a significant influence upon Brahms.

[Justin]

I enjoy it more than any of Brahms's symphonies, but am grateful to Johannes for the inspiration to Grimm. It's about pursuing a perfection of a style.