has anyone listened to the Romantic Piano Concerto Vol 50. Tchaikovsky? Absolutely stunning stuff. I was a bit unsure of the choice but after listening to Stephen Hough's versions I'm completely convinced that THIS WAS THE RIGHT CHOICE!!! Only HE can make the jaded 1st movement of the 1st concerto sound like a discovery. I was a bit surprised at the tempo, but as you listen to the whole movement you get what he's trying to do.
As for the neglected 2nd concerto, till now I the definitive version by Peter Donohoe. Stephen Hough's version is every bit as good (dare I say better??!!!).
Has anyone else heard it?
Bad news for Pixis fans.
till yesterday the info on RPC forthcoming volumes (I had ) were as follows
Vol.51 - Taubert concertos 1 & 2; Rosenhain concerto, (Howard Shelley) (Aug. '10)
Vol.52 - J. Wieniawski & Goetz concertos, (Hamish Milne) (Nov. '10)
Vol.53 - Reger Concerto; Strauss Burleske, (Marc-André Hamelin) (2011)
Vol.54 - Widor Concertos, (Markus Becker)
Vol.55 - English repertiore, being finalised this week I hope. (Martin Roscoe)
Vol.56 - Pixis Concerto plus something else (Howard Shelley)
Vol.57 - Wiklund Concertos (Martin Sturfalt).
Hyperion has announced the following series and unfortunately I can't find Pixis among them-
Volume 51 Taubert & Rosenhain
Volume 52 Goetz and Wieniawski
Volume 53 Reger and Strauss
Volume 54 Somervell and Cowen
Volume 55 Widor
Volume 56 Kalkbrenner
Volume 57 Wiklund
Let's say they release 2 more this year (wasn't the Taubert/Rosenhain planned for release after summer?) and 3 or 4 next year - does that mean we're going to have to miss out on Pixis until we're well in 2012? Or does anyone know if Hyperion is speeding up production, since they already know what the next 7 volumes are going to be?
As I understood from another thread, it's going to be the 2nd Götz concerto that appears on vol. 52? Too bad, I must say I have rather a soft spot for the 1st one, with its subtle syncopations and beautifully naive melodies... I'm really at a loss as to what Mike (or others) are thinking, with recording such boring concertos as the ones by Dreyschock and Kullak (and dare I say Herz in this forum?), but leaving out the 1st one by Götz!
Quote from: FBerwald on Thursday 01 April 2010, 20:52
As for the neglected 2nd concerto, till now I the definitive version by Peter Donohoe. Stephen Hough's version is every bit as good (dare I say better!!!?????!!!).
Is it even faster and more superficial than the Pletnev recording? Then I'll go out and buy it immediately! ;D
Watch yourself! There are some who have a soft spot for Herz! He was a much better tunesmith than I thought from his reputation before I heard him. And how can you find something boring that's here and gone in a flash? There are also admirers of the Kullak and Dreyschock concertos hereabouts. To each his own.
"...such boring concertos as the ones by...Kullak."
Thunder and lightning! I like Kullak's concerto. Particularly the opening tutti and entrance of the piano...;)
It's no use using boring as a critical cudgel. 'Boring' is entirely subjective and says as much about the mood/blood-sugar-level of the listener as it does about the piece and composer...
David
I wonder which of the Kalkbrenner concertos is the F-sharp Minor? I read a snippet of a Schumann review in which he mentioned (somewhat snidely) that the particular Kalkbrenner concerto he was reviewing was in that key (and also had some faux-programmatic pretentions).
Quote from: JimL on Friday 02 April 2010, 00:07
Watch yourself! There are some who have a soft spot for Herz! (...) To each his own.
Quote from: edurban on Friday 02 April 2010, 02:51
Thunder and lightning! I like Kullak's concerto. Particularly the opening tutti and entrance of the piano...;)
It's no use using boring as a critical cudgel. 'Boring' is entirely subjective and says as much about the mood/blood-sugar-level of the listener as it does about the piece and composer...
I should have expected reactions like those, and I have to apologise. Of course it's unfair of me to simply dismiss other people's favourites with one word (boring). I do admit I would find a forum "more fun" if one is allowed to trash some composers along with praising other ones, but I guess one could always find fans of even the most "uninteresting" (no, I'm not even going to start defining that word... :P ) composers. It's all Geschmacksfrage. But you did give me an idea for a new thread!
(I hope you both got my apologies through the jungle of sarcasm!)
As president of the NSPCH (National Society for prevention of cruelty to Herz), I forgive you ;D
Having spent an extremely pleasant couple of hours playing Herz nocturnes this morning, I would plead with you to look a little further into his works.
Thal
I'll take a shotgun to Herz any day.
From the President of LARK - League Against Ridiculous Konponisten...
Quote from: Alan Howe on Saturday 03 April 2010, 17:12
I'll take a shotgun to Herz any day.
From the President of LARK - League Against Ridiculous Konponisten...
Benighted Schumannist! >:( :P ;D
Quote from: tcutler on Saturday 03 April 2010, 17:08
Now that they've reached 50 volumes, I think it is high time to package all the recordings into one box set and sell it for cheap. I'd buy the entire 50-CD set in a second, but I must admit I don't have the motivation to buy most of single CDs individually. Any chances a box set might emerge in the future?
Hyperion? Who keep repressing the 1ste volume in that series over and over again, instead of releasing it on Helios? Forget it. The closest thing to an offer is presented on their website now, with every volume going for a tenner...
http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/o.asp?o=1027
Quote from: tcutler on Saturday 03 April 2010, 17:08
(...) I must admit I don't have the motivation to buy most of single CDs individually.
To P.S. that: you don't have to bother with Herz, so that'll be just 48 volumes for you... ;D
Egads! Another one! :'(
So you find Kalkbrenner superior, then? I love the 1st Kalky. I'd take any one of Herz' recorded concertos over the Kalkbrenner 4th.
Quote from: JimL on Saturday 03 April 2010, 17:56
Egads! Another one! :'(
Huh? I thought I was responsible for starting the Herz-bashing!
Quote from: JimL on Saturday 03 April 2010, 17:56
So you find Kalkbrenner superior, then? I love the 1st Kalky. I'd take any one of Herz' recorded concertos over the Kalkbrenner 4th.
The 1st Kalkbrenner I love, and have always loved, right from the opening measures. And I like superficial music - a lot! But I can't stand Herz! Perhaps I'm not ready for him yet? I reckon I'd develop a taste for his music after plowing through the entire oeuvre of the 2nd Viennese School...
Just think "kiddie concertos", Kriton! They're meant to be fun! They're training concertos for 8-year olds to play at community orchestra concerts and competitions! They're outdoor concert music for a Summer's eve! They're meant to be listened to while sitting on a blanket under the stars! That's it. Well, the 1st and 3rd may be a little more substantial, but they're still nothing but fun. I wish I could give the 2nd a listen, but apparently nobody takes much of an interest in it.
Quote from: Alan Howe on Saturday 03 April 2010, 17:12
I'll take a shotgun to Herz any day.
And I to Schumann Sir.
Thal
"Thalbergmad"
Nomen est omen... ;)
Much to my shame I had to look that up, but it would appear to be accurate.
I have infested other forums with my pathalogical hatred of Schumann, so I will remain silent and carry on enjoying some Herz.
Luv
Thal
Funny thing is I love Schumann's music. It's some of his opinions that I find intolerable. Of course, I could say the same of Wagner. ;)
Schumann is one of the all-time greats; Herz is......well, Herz.
I love to listen to the PC's of Herz, as well as those of Cramer, Hummel, Kalkbrenner, Moscheles, Ries, Tomášek, just to name a few of those piano virtuosos. Not much depth (except for Moscheles 3 and Hummel's opp. 85&89), but pleasant enough. Concertos which meet the taste of the audience of those days. Almost according to a marketing concept. What does the customer want? I'll make it for them. Just like businessmen. Some of them, if not all, were really commercial and made a lot of money.
Strangely enough I much more value the quality of their solo piano music, which seems to be much more sensible and have more individuality and depth. That goes certainly for Moscheles.
Schumann is of a totally other level. One of the Greatest ever, IMHO.
As for the RPC Vol. 50, to me it doesn't add something essential to which I already have. Is Stephen Hough in the PC's 2 and 3 much better or different than Elisabeth Leonskaja? I'm much more interested in Vol. 51.
Quote from: Peter1953 on Sunday 04 April 2010, 07:17
I'm much more interested in Vol. 51.
Me too. There will be a gap on my shelf where Vol. 50 would have been had i bought it.
Thal
Does anybody have an idea why Hyperion made their 50th volume into a Tchaikovsky disc? Is it to draw new costumers to the series? Or because it has some "unsung" (and for a reason...) fillers? And why the hell didn't they make the splendid Rachmaninov-cd (with Hough) part of the collection, if it's not just "unsung" concertos?
Being a collector, I think I'd still want to have it, although almost everything speaks against this recording; the repertoire, the programme (I love the Taneyev reconstruction of the 3rd concerto!), the price... I haven't heard the recording yet, so perhaps I could still be convinced of its value, but I regard this jubilee cd as a missed opportunity.
As a Schumann devotee, I'd rather have seen the Schumann concerto & both pieces for piano & orchestra, as well as the Raff transcription of the Konzertstück for 4 horns & orchestra, much like on the ARTS cd. That'd constitute for a better "sung"/"unsung" recording... But, perhaps at no. 100 we will have a splendid cd of Grieg/Schumann concertos!
Quote from: Kriton on Sunday 04 April 2010, 15:51
But, perhaps at no. 100 we will have a splendid cd of Grieg/Schumann concertos!
Hopefully Hyperion would have completely exhausted the genre before vomiting another version of that obnoxious pairing upon the listening public.
Thal
Quote from: thalbergmad on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:17
Quote from: Kriton on Sunday 04 April 2010, 15:51
But, perhaps at no. 100 we will have a splendid cd of Grieg/Schumann concertos!
Hopefully Hyperion would have completely exhausted the genre before vomiting another version of that obnoxious pairing upon the listening public.
Thal
The two Schumann concert pieces for piano and orchestra, though (hardly unknown, but as pointed out this is
not "the Hyperion unknown piano concerto" series) as filler to some appropriate work, could be another matter...
At least RPC 50 does include the Concert Fantasy and a couple of other works besides the three piano concertos.
Eric
Quote from: Kriton on Sunday 04 April 2010, 15:51
As a Schumann devotee, I'd rather have seen the Schumann concerto & both pieces for piano & orchestra
You could probably fit them all on the same disk. Due to the repetitiveness of the last movement of the concerto, it can in fact be condensed to 8 seconds without losing any meaning.
Thal
Quote from: thalbergmad on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:29
Due to the repetitiveness of the last movement of the concerto, it can in fact be condensed to 8 seconds without losing any meaning.
Thal
I take it you'd rather have 8 concertos by Herz than 8 seconds by Schumann? :o
Quote from: thalbergmad on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:29
Quote from: Kriton on Sunday 04 April 2010, 15:51
As a Schumann devotee, I'd rather have seen the Schumann concerto & both pieces for piano & orchestra
You could probably fit them all on the same disk. Due to the repetitiveness of the last movement of the concerto, it can in fact be condensed to 8 seconds without losing any meaning.
Thal
I've always thought of the
first movement, with its overly sequential development - a weak point for Schumann (in this piece, not generally, I mean) - as repetitive, not the (fun, imhonesto) finale...
I wonder if someone has attempted a reconstruction of the original form of the first movement, if there are clues as to how it differed from its present form - if it did?
Anyhow, way off topic. Sorry.
Eric
Quote from: Kriton on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:33
Quote from: thalbergmad on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:29
Due to the repetitiveness of the last movement of the concerto, it can in fact be condensed to 8 seconds without losing any meaning.
Thal
I take it you'd rather have 8 concertos by Herz than 8 seconds by Schumann? :o
I would rather have something that has not been recorded than something that has been recorded a thousand times.
Thal
Quote from: thalbergmad on Sunday 04 April 2010, 19:00
Quote from: Kriton on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:33
Quote from: thalbergmad on Sunday 04 April 2010, 18:29
Due to the repetitiveness of the last movement of the concerto, it can in fact be condensed to 8 seconds without losing any meaning.
Thal
I take it you'd rather have 8 concertos by Herz than 8 seconds by Schumann? :o
I would rather have something that has not been recorded than something that has been recorded a thousand times.
Thal
The BBC's attempt to broadcast everything by Stravinsky and Tchaikovsky turned up works by the two that hadn't been recorded; whether there's unrecorded (Robert) Schumann out there I hesitate to guess, but it sounds like a false dichotomy. (And of some major works by Schumann we're still waiting for a first really good recording, I gather. Genoveva, I gather, is one...)
Eric
The development of the 1st movement of the Schumann concerto is fine just as it is, and contains a most ingenious specimen of thematic transformation. And the only fault of the finale is the literalness of the reprise. This is surely a minor quibble, since many equally fine works "suffer" from much the same flaw!
Such Anti-Tchaikovsky feelings? I agree, the primary reason the RPC series interests us is because of the relatively unheard material they bring to light (I shall forever be thankful to THEM for Vol. 11). Nobody was more disappointed than I to learn that Vol. 50 was Tchaikovsky but after listening to it I revised my opinion... All I am saying is give it a listen before making any judgments . You might be surprised!!!!!
I will buy it if the 1st concerto is better than Horowitz recording and the 2nd better than Richter.
Thal
When did Richter record Tchaikovsky PC2? I'd be interested in that...
Oops, I mean Gilels not Richter.
Thal
I know this is old news now, but as a season subscriber to the Minnesota Orchestra for over 50 years, perhaps you'll forgive me. I was thrilled when I learned that the MN would be featured on the 50th RPC. I was totally bummed when I found out what they were recording. As a guarantor I got a free copy as part of a gift deal - I would not have purchased it. The performances were live (perhaps the only way that Hyperion could afford the Minnesota) , WERE stunning and audience noise is minimal. Sound is "Orchestra Hall with 2000 in the audience" and not close miked as some folks like. Why couldn't they have done something REALLY SPECIAL?? But then, the MInnesota hasn't played anything unsung for at least 25 years.......
Hrm. They are doing Walton and Aho concertos during the coming season, which I wouldn't mind hearing, though that's not quite what you mean!
Eric
Hyperion 54 - The Somervell scheduled for release in September is now available for preorder at Amazon.com (US)
Jerry