Unsung Composers

The Music => Recordings & Broadcasts => Topic started by: alharris on Tuesday 28 January 2014, 21:57

Title: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: alharris on Tuesday 28 January 2014, 21:57
I can barely contain my excitement. I just read an item in the February Gramophone indicating that Chandos has recorded all four Scharwenka Piano Concertos for late April release.   Alexander Markovich (a name unfamiliar to me) is the soloist; Neeme Jarvi conducts the Estonian National SO.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: edurban on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 03:00
Be still my heart.  I hope for a not-too-reverberant acoustic for #2 which is somewhat thickly orchestrated and tends to sound murky.  My favorite 2nd at the moment (from an orchestral perspective) is on Centaur... the Czech National Orchestra under Paul Freeman (Laurence Jeanningros, piano) where you can hear much of the detail obscured in other recordings, even if there is little warmth.  The piano playing is very good, often poetic, though in the coupling (the first concerto) Mme. (or Mlle.) Jeanningros is clearly not in the barn-storming league of Wild and Hamelin.

I dearly love these pieces.  Thanks for the heads-up.

David

Ps. I see the following on the Scharwenka Society website:

In October 2000 Maestro Neeme Järvi conducted Xaver Scharwenka`s "Olympian" Piano Concerto No.4 with Detroit SO and Philadelphia Orchestra . Pianist Alexander Markovich gave it in Detroit 4 performances ("spectacular - his tour de force not only brought down the house, it drew genuine applause from an orchestra and conductor, who clearly enjoyed the ride" - Detroit News).

In November 2nd and 3rd 2002 Alexander Markovich has performed this concerto at Berlin Philharmonic (cond. Neeme Järvi) with tremendous success.

Further performances of this concerto will take place in 2004 in Cologne and Goeteborg.

So Jarvi and Markovich have been promoting Scharwenka (at least #4) for a while...
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 07:25
Very good news indeed. Thanks for the heads-up indeed.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 14:53
Wonderful news. Its weird but I the last week going through the complete concerto cycle of Scharwenka... I wonder if the pianist will be able to match / surpass (??) Stephen Hough rendition of the 4th which I have felt was a benchmark! As a Scharwenka fanatic I shall keep an open mind [and ears!!!!] :-)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: jerfilm on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 15:36
Well, they're among my all time favorite concertos - especially #3, an opinion that doesn't seem to be shared by many.   However, another full set?  Probably not.

J
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 19:04
@jerfilm I understand what you mean about the 3rd concerto... I still find No. 3 a bit of a challenge. I still listen to it on occasions in the hope that I might crack it sometime!! 
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: LateRomantic75 on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 20:10
I'm afraid I can't muster as much enthusiasm as some have for the second and third PCs. To me, they seem rather "hollow", for lack of a better word. The presiding influence of Chopin in both works doesn't help their substantiality. The First and (especially) Fourth concertos, however, are magnificent works of blazing passion and epic sweep. To be fair, one of the main reasons why I can't really get behind the second and third concertos is because they seem dull in comparison to the surrounding two, quite frankly. Pleasant and occasionally charming works in their own right? Yes. Undeservedly neglected masterworks? No.

But who knows? Maybe the upcoming Chandos recording will change my opinion of them! :)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Vodnik on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 20:38
I love all four Scharwenka concertos and am as excited as Al Harris and Ed Urban about the impending release of these new recordings. I think they embody the very best of the romantic piano concerto (my favorite genre). They share the same features--grand gestures, melting melodic lines, virtuosic piano writing, and powerful orchestral accompaniments. The fiery and impetuous 1st, the powerful 2nd (which contains my very favorite piano entrance in the 1st movement), the plaintive and soulful 3rd (which is in my favorite key, c# minor), and the magisterial 4th, the capstone of Scharwenka's output, comprise a body of work that is unmatched by other composers in the late 19th century.

I will always regret the fact that I missed seeing a live performance of the 4th concerto with Stephen Hough in 3/96 in Indianapolis as I had to move to Pennsylvania 2 weeks earlier. I remember what a reviewer had said in a review of the Earl Wild recording of the 1st concerto in 1970--this was music so good that it will bring tears to your ears. Later on, another reviewer likened Scharwenka's music to "Chopin on steroids". Perhaps these new recordings will initiate a Scharwenka renaissance, with more performances around the world (particularly in the US).

I disagree with LateRomantic75's assessment of the 2nd and 3rd concertos. To me, they're just as full of blazing passion and epic sweep as their companions. I find them both incredibly exciting and like the other two, unjustly neglected masterworks that deserve to be resurrected and played again and again instead of the zillionth performance of the usual warhorses.

BTW, has anyone else noticed the "wrong note" in the only recording of the 3rd concerto (Seta Tanyel)? In the score, it opens with 2 French horns playing the main theme in unison starting on the first beat of the first bar. The rest of the orchestra then comes in on the third beat with a G# major dominant seventh chord. In the recording, the violins play a high G# just before the French horns play the opening melody. I though it was an odd way to start the concerto until I saw the score and realized that it was wrong.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 20:55
I will still beg you to give the 2nd and 3rd  a few more hearings [clear your mind off 1 & 4... if possible]
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 21:10
I've always loved PCs 2 and 3 as much as 1 and 4. If Chandos really do bring them all out in excellent performances, it'll be quite an event.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: LateRomantic75 on Wednesday 29 January 2014, 22:20
Thanks for the encouraging replies everyone! I guess it's just the fiery romantic in me that draws me to the more extroverted first and fourth PCs instead of the more introverted middle two. I'll be getting the new Chandos recording when it comes out and hope to experience an epiphany! ;D
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Rob H on Thursday 30 January 2014, 08:48
I too await these with baited breath! Regarding number three I have to say I was disappointed when I heard Tanyel's recording of it - numbers 1, 2 and 4 had this amazing sweep and virtuosity and suddenly there was this concerto that didn't seem to know where to go. Then I heard Ludwig Hofmann playing it and it was glorious. It just felt like a different piece. It was the same with the second. Tanyel underwhelmed me. My favourite is still Lewenthal's recording of (unfortunately) just the finale of the second - what a performance.
I seem to remember that Harold Schoenberg in Great Pianists said that the Scharwenka Concertos fell out of fashion once the Rakhmaninov Concertos appeared - were the Scharwenka ever that popular?? I would like to think so but it seems unlikely.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Thursday 30 January 2014, 09:33
Is the Hofmann version available on amazon?
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Rob H on Thursday 30 January 2014, 10:23
Sorry, the Hofmann is not a commercial recording. I recorded the audio off a youtube video some time ago. I can upload the recording if the moderators are happy.
Rob
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Thursday 30 January 2014, 11:16
Please do. Its not there on youtube
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Thursday 30 January 2014, 16:37
What's the original source of the Hofmann recording, though?
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Rob H on Thursday 30 January 2014, 17:27
I don't know. I assume it is German radio - it was uploaded by Musikpensioner who uploaded lots of old radio recordings. I think it's live - I'll have to relisten. Beyond that I have no info.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Thursday 30 January 2014, 18:57
We still need more info, I think.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: alharris on Saturday 22 February 2014, 10:51
I just found this release info for the Scharwenka Concertos on MDT's website:

http://www.mdt.co.uk/scharwenka-complete-piano-concertos-alexander-markovich-neeme-jarvi-chandos-2cds.html (http://www.mdt.co.uk/scharwenka-complete-piano-concertos-alexander-markovich-neeme-jarvi-chandos-2cds.html)

Given that he release date is March 31, I would expect the download to be available circa March 1.

Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Friday 28 February 2014, 20:05
alharris reports:

The new Chandos recording of the 4 Scharwenka Piano Concertos is available for download now.

http://www.theclassicalshop.net/Details.aspx?CatalogueNumber=CHAN%2010814 (http://www.theclassicalshop.net/Details.aspx?CatalogueNumber=CHAN%2010814)

Al Harris
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: JimL on Tuesday 08 April 2014, 05:23
I got this in my email today: http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Chandos/CHAN10814?utm_source=News-2014-04-07&utm_medium=email#listen (http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Chandos/CHAN10814?utm_source=News-2014-04-07&utm_medium=email#listen)

With this, all 4 of his concertos have been recorded at least twice.  Dare we call him "sung"?

Nah.  But it's a good start. :)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 09 April 2014, 17:48
I'd say this set is worth getting for the dynamic performance of PC3 alone - it's very different to Tanyel/Strugala on Hyperion. Comparative timings:
Tanyel/Strugala: 15:48/9:29/12:49   (37:57)
Markovich/Järvi:  14:06/6:41/10:41   (31:28)
In other words, Markovich/Järvi are about 20% faster....
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: dpal on Sunday 13 April 2014, 15:51
The cheapest download of the new Scharwenka album is here:
http://www.emusic.com/album/-/-/14846420/ (http://www.emusic.com/album/-/-/14846420/)

I'm just downloading it. Enjoy!

(I hope the link works from the US as well.)

Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Rob H on Sunday 13 April 2014, 19:39
Thanks for reminding me that it is on emusic. Have just downloaded it and have listened to the first movement of number 2. Hmmm... Well it's good to have new recordings of them but I'm not massively impressed on the strength of this movement. He is a very heavy handed player - ignores some of the quieter dynamics and is four-square in his phrasing. He slows down for some of the more taxing figurations and is just technically bad at the final piano solo sextuplets before the cadenza (page 61 in the full score from imslp).
I'll plough on as time allows and see what my overall impression is.
Rob

Just listened to my favourite Scharwenka movement (no2 finale) and hate this recording. His rhythms are lazy in the extreme (every hemidemisemiquaver in the main theme is just played as a triplet as are the mordants) and dotted rhythms are virtually triplets. His left hand tends to play loud and solidly when the right hand has fast passagework and the whole thing lacks bounce. I don't feel much of a sense of dance here. The overall impression I get is that the concerto is right at the edge of his technique. I'm quite disappointed as I was really looking forward to this set.
Am I alone in my negative opinion?
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Monday 14 April 2014, 09:56
I haven't heard the complete works but just the samples but I to say that I have not been overtly impressed. His handling of the Scherzo IInd movement of Concerto no 1 seems to me pretty "lazy". The The 1st and 4th movement of the 4th concerto seems very soggy in comparison to the Hough version, but then again, like I said I haevn't listened to the whole piece(s) so may be I am wrong.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Rob H on Monday 14 April 2014, 14:41
Soggy - that is just such a great description of what I felt. I waited for crispness of articulation and waited in vain. Yes, soggy.
Rob
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 15 April 2014, 01:02
Articulation (and not just of rhythms; "just" making clear what's important, giving things direction...)- now there's something that can raise a performance above "the pack" :)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Martin Eastick on Wednesday 16 April 2014, 13:13
I listened to the 2nd (my personal favourite) for the first time a few days ago and eagerly awaiting the initial piano entry, I have to admit that I was immediately disappointed. This disappointment grew steadily as the concerto progressed and by the end I was thinking that this first complete cycle was most definitely an opportunity lost by Chandos. Moving on to the Op32, which I went to next, my expectations were considerably lowered, and again, was most underwhelmed.

I wholeheartedly agree with other comments already raised here and would also add that there seem to be misreadings both in the actual notes as well as in the rhythmic detail. I haven't yet tried out the 3rd & 4th, but I'm prepared for the worst! My other concern here is that the negative reception already received here will surely be echoed in any number of reviews etc., which may severely disadvantage Scharwenka's reputation and also discourage further performances and/or recordings. Perhaps also Chandos may not wish to proceed with a new recording of the Symphony, which surely would have been a logical successor to this set. We can only hope that Naxos may continue perhaps with another complete cycle?...........
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Wednesday 16 April 2014, 13:20
Martin, I wouldn't worry about Scharwenka's reputation. The reviews reflect on the performers, the pianist mainly. Chandos could have tried Hough for the complete set and we would def. have a winner. The problem lies in the fact the music, essencially the solo part, is extremely taxing as well as imaginative so a very capable and dedicated player is needed. Missed opportunity as i can conclude. Let's hear from the other members.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: jerfilm on Wednesday 16 April 2014, 14:24
Well, as all know, I'm never at a loss for words.  Except when your reviews are as bad as these are.  Frankly, I have better things to spend my sheckles on than something panned this heavily.  Thanks for that......   Really.n

Jerry
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 16 April 2014, 16:09
Well, here's a very different opinion:

By Guy Mannering (at Amazon.co.uk):
The Scharwenka piano concertos, in my opinion, are every bit as good as those of Saint-Saens, but whilst three of the latter's five always retained some favour with star virtuosos and recording companies, those of Scharwenka inexplicably fell into near-oblivion. This new set of all four Scharwenka concertos is therefore most welcome. If you haven't sampled any of them before, my advice would be to start with his third, and then follow with the fourth, first and second in that order. Although the fourth is generally accounted his finest work the third, in my opinion, is his most attractive and indelible concerto, indeed of all those countless romantic piano concertos that fell by the wayside Scharwenka's third is the one I find the easiest to recall. The slow movement of this concerto must surely rank as Scharwenka's most beautiful creation. But even when his melodic and thematic material isn't always quite top-drawer, as in his second, the musical pyrotechnics never fail to hold the attention.

These are tremendous performances, in no ways inferior to those currently available on the Hyperion label in their Romantic Piano Concerto series. The sheer heft and power of Alexander Markovich's playing will have you pinned to your seat - his account of the third's first movement is impressively muscular and just listen to the dazzling way he dashes off the scherzo of the first concerto (one of Scharwenka's best movements that easily stands comparison with the famous scherzo of Saint-Saens' second) to get the measure of this pianist's virtuosity. However I thought that he and maestro Jarvi were not quite as successful in bringing out the reflective poetic quality of the third's slow movement as Seta Tanyel on the Hyperion release.

The recording venue for these performances (the Nokia Concert Hall in Tallinn) has a rather cavernous acoustic and the orchestra sounds a bit recessed so that orchestral textures are not always ideally clear especially in the louder passages, Thus the majestic orchestral opening of the third seems to emanate from the back of the hall and produces a rather muted effect ( the Hyperion recording again scores extra points here.) And the tone produced by Markovich's piano has a slightly clangy, metallic edge. But I don't want to make too much of these points, they're minor negatives and I don't think there's anything serious enough to spoil your listening pleasure.

I paid a tenner for this 2 disc release although I notice the Amazon price has edged up by about a pound at the time of leaving this review. Certainly at around a tenner this release is a very good bargain and if you're keen to start investigating neglected or forgotten romantic piano concertos then I don't think you need hesitate. Warmly recommended.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 16 April 2014, 16:13
...and another positive review at Classical CD Choice:

SCHARWENKA: PIANO CONCERTOS, Alexander Markovich, Estonian National Symphony Orchestra, Neeme Järvi/CHANDOS CHAN 10814(2) Largely forgotten today, the Polish-born German composer Franz Xaver Scharwenka was a much lauded figure of late-nineteenth- and early-twentieth-century music. His four piano concertos are central works among his small output. With Neeme Järvi and the Estonian National Symphony Orchestra, Alexander Markovich has here recorded them together for the first time. There is an air of the faded here, but the best possible case is made for the music.



Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: eschiss1 on Thursday 17 April 2014, 23:05
If thinking about purchasing the new set and having worries, maybe one or more recordings from the set will be broadcast on some radio station (if not BBC, then perhaps Radio Stephansdom or another) that webcasts with fairly good quality within a reasonable time, which might help a person reach some decision on their own? Don't know. (Maybe too soon given the release date, though, except for new release programs... hrm.)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: JimL on Friday 18 April 2014, 20:54
I can sort of see the problem.  Listening to the orchestral introduction on the sample from Concerto no. 1, I expected Earl Wild when the piano came in.  What I got was Seta Tanyel.  The pianism was rather turgid.  I think that whoever said that this music is right on the edge of Markovich's technical capability is right on the money.  He couldn't keep up with the tempos set by Jaarvi.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Saturday 19 April 2014, 22:37
QuoteThere is an air of the faded here, but the best possible case is made for the music.

What on earth does this mean? This is the sort of vacant criticism that does music such as this (and music generally) a disservice. In what sense is Scharwenka "faded"? Why does a case need to be made for the music? This reviewer has obviously imbibed the received opinion that anyone who is not of the calibre of Brahms or Beethoven is not really worth listening to. What callow rubbish!
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Mark Thomas on Sunday 20 April 2014, 08:09
Now there's a harrumph with which I totally agree, Gareth!

Yours in curmudgeonliness etc....

;)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Sunday 20 April 2014, 09:09
At least the reviewer liked the performances...
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Sunday 20 April 2014, 16:25
That's what bothers me. The reviewer liked these performances. Has he/she never heard the Hough/Tanyel/Wild performances? Even the Hamelin version [not my fav.] seems more desirable.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Sunday 20 April 2014, 20:02
Well, I liked them too. And I like Tanyel (in her more deliberate way) also. In any case, we haven't got Wild, Hamelin or Hough in all four concertos. So, I'm particularly glad to have Markovich in Nos.2 and 3.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: adriano on Thursday 24 April 2014, 08:41
Just bought and listened the Markovich Schwarwenka Piano Concertos. They are sensationally well played, interpreted and conducted! From both artists: fabulous dynamics. Let me shake my head - just a little - to some posh criticism in here... The sound may be a bit a problem, but one gets used to it. I wish I could work with such an excellent soloist! Järvi too, carries on holding an incredible tension over each movement, in this, he always succeds and makes his conducting great. It's like a live recording.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Thursday 24 April 2014, 15:01
As I indicated before, I very much liked these performances too. They're of the barnstorming variety, but there's plenty of subtlety too. And of course soloist and conductor had been performing in concerts too, so it's no wonder the recordings sound like live performances.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: jerfilm on Tuesday 29 April 2014, 18:20
I just listened to a youtube upload of the Jarvi 3rd and in my humble opinion, it's a lot of crashing and banging with a subsequent loss of the subtle beauty of the piece.  I'm glad i didn't buy the set.

Jerry
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Tuesday 29 April 2014, 20:43
Quotea lot of crashing and banging

Or barnstorming, according to taste. I'm glad I did buy it - especially at the 2 CDs for 1 price.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Wednesday 30 April 2014, 09:06
Alan, I think this is one of those recordings which will bring out very varied opinions; opinions which people seem to be sticking to [I have still not heard these recordings]. Who knew Scharwenka would create a little storm in our unsung teacup! :D
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 30 April 2014, 16:20
Michael Jameson in International Record Review (May issue, just out) calls the set 'a personal triumph for Markovich who consistently delivers titanic pianism that few can match these days'. Overall, it is an 'invaluable and authoritative issue'. I wholeheartedly concur.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Tuesday 09 September 2014, 22:38
Two further very positive reviews:
http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2014/Sep14/Scharwenka_PCs_CHAN10814.htm (http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2014/Sep14/Scharwenka_PCs_CHAN10814.htm)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Wednesday 10 September 2014, 06:25
Dear Alan, I agree that there are many (seems many!) positive reviews, BUT I am still disappointed. The reasons -

1. [personal opinion so please don't tear me to bits!] Mr. Markovich is not a sensitive player. There is a difference between Forte and Banging the piano and I'm afraid all I heard was a lot of banging of the keys. I'm sorry to say this but thanks to this CD I'm really warming up to Hemalin, who I usually don't much care for.

2. The overuse of rubato destroys especially the 4th and 1st concerto. At places the orchestra or/and piano stops and the pause in between makes one wonder if they have not all gone for a tea break!

3. On the positive side. All of the above can be forgiven for the gift of the 2nd concerto. It was like listening to it for the first time. Amazing playing, both from the orchestra [just why I love Jarvi] and Mr. Markovich. I have listened to this concerto atleast half a dozen times by now. Thank you Markovich, Jarvi and Chandos. The whole album is more than worth for just this performance alone. Someone please play this in concert.... may be the Proms :D !

I still can't warm up to the 3rd concerto [no ref. to the players!]. May be It's just not for me! :)
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 10 September 2014, 09:13
It's good to have the contrary view - especially when accompanied by concrete examples. Thanks for telling us what you think.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: jerfilm on Wednesday 10 September 2014, 15:15
I'm feeling like an idiot.  Not at home to check it out.  But the performance of the 3rd that I treasure is on an old reel to reel tape, goes WAY back and I can't remember for the life of me who the artists are.  Will try to remember to check it when I get home next month.  No banging and pounding, a much more sensitive reading.  And if it was from a broadcast, I will upload it.

Anyone else have a clue who this might be??

Jerry
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: pablothepiano on Tuesday 16 September 2014, 12:36
Dear friends,

I am so happy that people are more and more discovering Xaver Scharwenka's music. I personally regard it very high and I am a little surprised that he is not as famous as his contemporaries. I like the sense of his piano concertos. For me they are sort of a mix of Chopin, Schumann, Brahms and Rachmaninoff on many levels (the phrase, the texture, the brilliance and lyricism and also their lenght.

Anyway, I would like to ask you a question. Does anyone know what form the 3rd Piano Concerto has? This is my favourite, but I'm finding some trouble working it out. Maybe someone could take a look? I think it would help me to understand it better.

Btw, I think the last recording by Markovich is pretty good, I like his strong hand. I think it fits the music.

All the best

Pablo
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: pablothepiano on Tuesday 16 September 2014, 22:04
I have done some thinking and it might be the big A B A form (i mean the wholw concerto, like Liszt's first) and each separate movement has it own free form.... Though i am not certain.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Alan Howe on Tuesday 16 September 2014, 22:15
Martin Eastick's notes on the Tanyel recording of PC3 at Hyperion's website read as follows:

The first performance of the Piano Concerto No 3 in C sharp minor, with Scharwenka himself as soloist once again, marked his welcome return to Berlin as a performer in January 1899 after a seven-year absence, and he had a magnificent reception. The third concerto is symphonically much stronger than the second, where the emphasis is very much on the soloist. Here the piano and orchestra are much more integrated. Thematically Scharwenka tends to follow Liszt's example with regard to cyclic form, and although he still retains the three separate movements (the finale follows the second without a break), the main theme from the first movement is varied in lyrical form in the second, and it appears as the main theme in the third movement also, this time with rhythmic variation. Again, in the finale, as with the second concerto, Scharwenka reminds us of his Polish origins.

Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Thursday 22 November 2018, 18:12
Just been listening to the Seta Tanyel version of the 1st Piano Concert and struck again by the wonderfully detailed reading of this underrated and sensitive pianist as opposed to the fiery versions by Wild and Hamelin.
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: Ilja on Friday 23 November 2018, 08:09
To be fair, I think this genre of concertos is more conducive to power play than subtlety (with the possible exception of no. 3), and in that sense Hamelin and Markovich do what the score expects them to do. That is not to say this is the only possible approach, but it is the obvious one. Having said that, my personal favorite recording of the Second Concerto is the perhaps somewhat self-indulgent one by Jeanningros.

Am I correct in remembering that Tanyel's disc of nos. 2 & 3 were a re-release of a Collins disc?
Title: Re: Xaver Scharwenka Piano Concertos
Post by: FBerwald on Friday 23 November 2018, 08:50
Yes, The Tanyel No. 2 & 3 is a re-release.... and I agree with you. It's just the Tanyel reading of the 1st concerto is my guilty pleasure - There are passages in the 1st movement that I feel cries out for very subtle handling (like the 2nd theme). I haven't heard the Jeanningros recordings - its on Presto website for download (without the booklet which kind of discourages me at times from adding it to the cart!) - What's your opinion of them?