Unsung Composers

The Music => Composers & Music => Topic started by: Peter1953 on Sunday 26 September 2010, 16:21

Title: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Peter1953 on Sunday 26 September 2010, 16:21
Besides an interesting and strong personality, Sergey Taneyev wrote some beautiful music.
Time for further exploring this composer. However, I have only two CD's. His Symphonies 2 & 4 under Polyansky on Chandos, and his Piano Concerto and some works for solo piano on Toccata Classics. Although his PC (1876, left unfinished) doesn't impress me so much (the Allegro of 25 minutes is far too long, IMHO) I'm overwhelmed by the Symphonies, especially the 4th. That is really a great, stirring work. I know he wrote quite a lot of chamber music.

Any recommendations?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Mark Thomas on Sunday 26 September 2010, 20:49
Peter, both Chandos and Naxos now have CDs coupling the First and Third Symphonies (comparative review at Musicweb International here (http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2008/May08/Taneyev_8570336.htm)). Personally I prefer the Polyansky interpretations for Chandos, but Sanderling on Naxos also gets good reviews. They're great pieces which I'm sure you'll enjoy. I've also found the Northern Lights series of CDs with all the String Quartets a very rewarding experience.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Alan Howe on Sunday 26 September 2010, 21:05
The Piano Quintet and Piano Trio on DG...

http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Serge-Tanejew-Klavierquintett-op-30/hnum/6795696 (http://www.jpc.de/jpcng/classic/detail/-/art/Serge-Tanejew-Klavierquintett-op-30/hnum/6795696)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 27 September 2010, 00:50
There's been several recordings of his wonderful piano quintet 'over the years', including a fine one in my opinion (by itself) on an Arabesque CD some years back... haven't heard others yet but not surprised if some are better still (for all that I esteem that one and I do.)
How's the (start of the) Naxos recording of his string quartets- maybe-- if possible, just suggesting :)- putting aside comparisons with the older series, which had the advantage of the Leningrad Taneev Quartet (a really fine quartet which did integral recordings of Taneev's and Myaskovsky's quartets among other pieces) in its favor? (Have actually only heard their Myaskovsky set, not yet their Taneev set. But they were a very good group...)
Eric
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Amphissa on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 00:19
 
I love the music of Taneyev and have (I think) almost every commercial recording released of his music as well as some broadcast recordings.

His "St John of Damascus" is arguably the most beautiful choral work ever written for Russian voices. I am not a huge fan or choral music, but this one grabs me every time.

The "Suite de Concert", op. 28, is a splendid violin concerto (in all but name)

The "Oresteia' overture is his most delicious shorter orchestral piece.

These are the three large scale works that I consider his best, other than the 4th symphony. They are available in many assorted couplings, which can make for confusing purchasing choices.

There are some outstanding recordings of the "Suite de Concert". Oistrakh was the dedicatee of the work, premiered it, and made the first recording, which is coupled with the Khachaturian Violin Concerto on an EMI Great Recordings of the Century CD. The same Oistrakh recording is coupled with Rostrapovich's exceptionally fine recording of Myaskovsky's beautiful Cello Concerto. The third recommendable CD is Ashkenazy's coupling of the "Suite de Concert" with the "Oresteia" overture and other orchestral extracts from that opera. This is a first rate recording of the violin piece, coupled with perhaps the best recording of the "Oresteia" overture -- in better audio than the other two. So, go for the coupling that interests you most.

With a deep sense of revulsion, I'll recommend the Pletnev recording of "John of Damascus." The alternative recordings are not as good, plus it is coupled with Rachmaninoff's magnificent choral symphony "The Bells." There are better recordings of "The Bells", but if you do not have it in your collection, this is a good coupling.

If you are as disgusted as I am by Pletnev, I'd say to go with Sanderling. I really do not like Fedoseyev's approach to music at all, Polyansky is kinda mushy sounding, and Golovanov is eccentric.

If you do not go with Ashkenazy's recording of the "Oresteia" overture, the next best recording is by Jarvi, coupled with a very good recording of Taneyev's 4th symphony. You already have the 4th, but if you do not have Jarvi's recording, you might decide it is worth the investment. Very good audio.

As for the chamber music, the big chamber music competition/festival in Russia is rightfully named after Taneyev. Although some of the string quartets can be a bit dry, I really like the Piano Trio and the Piano Quartet.  There are several fine recordings of the Piano Trio. I like the Borodin Trio's recording, but there is no coupling. The Taneyev Quartet coupled the Piano Trio with the Trio for Two Violins and Viola, an unusual instrumentation. The couple of both the Piano Trio and the Piano Quartet can be had on a CD by the Mendelssohn Piano Trio.

Once again, if your disgust permits, the recording of the Piano Trio coupled with the Piano Quintet is well performed.

Discovery of the music of Taneyev was one of my great unsung adventures, and his music remains among my favorite of the unsungs.

Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 04:28
Apparently there was also a recording by the Odeon Trio of Taneyev's piano trio (to distinguish it from his numerous string trios, I will write that out in full :) ) with one by Alexander Tcherpenin. Has anyone heard that recording?...
Eric
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Mark Thomas on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 08:44
QuoteIf you are as disgusted as I am by Pletnev
Isn't someone innocent until they're proved guilty?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Peter1953 on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 11:04
Thank you all very much for your valuable suggestions!

I've followed Amphissa's recommendation and ordered the Suite de Concert coupled with Myaskowsky's Cello Concerto (I think his VC op. 44 is beautiful, I have Repin's performance).
I also ordered Taneyev's Piano Quintet and Piano Trio on DG, which is a good recommendation from Alan, and, like Mark suggests, his Symphonies 1&3 under Polyansky (also because I like his performances of 2&4). BTW, quite a lot of his String Quartets are available. Where to start?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: khorovod on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 15:04
Quote from: Amphissa on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 00:19

The "Suite de Concert", op. 28, is a splendid violin concerto (in all but name)
sorted couplings, which can make for confusing purchasing choices.

There are some outstanding recordings of the "Suite de Concert". Oistrakh was the dedicatee of the work, premiered it, and made the first recording, which is coupled with the Khachaturian Violin Concerto on an EMI Great Recordings of the Century CD.

Are you sure about this, I hadn't heard this fact mentioned before? I thought the concert suite was written in 1909, when Oistrakh was only one year old. Oistrakh's debut was at aged 6 in Odessa a year before Taneyev died and he didn't enter Odessa conservatory for several more years after that. It all seems unlikely given the dates.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 15:30
Agreed- the preface (http://www.musikmph.de/musical_scores/vorworte/499.html) to the MPH edition of the Concert Suite mentions Oistrakh's championship of the work but no such dedication, and confirms the 1909 composition date.
Eric
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Amphissa on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 18:14
 
Ack! My apology. It was Myaskovsky's Violin Concerto dedicated to Oistrakh, not Taneyev's Suite de Concert. Not sure where that notion came from.

I've had a bad cold for a week and have been eating antihistamines. So I may have gotten that wrong too, but I'm too groggy to look anything up.

Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Revilod on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 19:29
I can vouch for the quality of the DG recording of the Piano Quintet and Trio. By an odd coincidence, just two days ago I posted a review of it on Amazon.co.uk

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Taneyev-Piano-Quintet-Trio/dp/B0009AM5GS/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1285698284&sr=1-1

By the way, do any other forum members write online reviews? Shouldn't we all be spreading the word?!
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 04:12
Quote from: Revilod on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 19:29
I can vouch for the quality of the DG recording of the Piano Quintet and Trio. By an odd coincidence, just two days ago I posted a review of it on Amazon.co.uk

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Taneyev-Piano-Quintet-Trio/dp/B0009AM5GS/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1285698284&sr=1-1

By the way, do any other forum members write online reviews? Shouldn't we all be spreading the word?!
It seems that Oistrakh was the dedicatee of Myaskovsky's and his (Mya's) student Khachaturian's violin concertos, yes.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Alan Howe on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 07:59
Quote from: Revilod on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 19:29
By the way, do any other forum members write online reviews? Shouldn't we all be spreading the word?!

Yes, I have written one or two at Amazon - but they have to be well done. A badly written review (all puff, no argument or evidence) can be counter-productive. Nevertheless, it's a good point and a sure-fire way of attracting customers if done well.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Jamie on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 12:38
Quote from: Revilod on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 19:29
By the way, do any other forum members write online reviews?

On amazon.com, I have posted reviews of the DG recording of Taneyev's Piano Quintet as well as 3 Raff recordings: the recent Tra Nguyen recordings of Die Tageszeiten and the Suite for Piano and Orchestra, and the Trio Opus 8's version of Piano Trios 1 and 4.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Revilod on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 14:36
Those are very well written reviews, Jamie.  As Alan, says, it's important to write positively.  How that reviewer of the DG Taneyev disc could describe the music as "bland", "completely uninteresting" and "pretty boring" and give the disc just one star is beyond me.  He's entitled to his opinion of course but thank goodness for you and the other reviewers who stepped in with what is, surely, a more considered view.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: khorovod on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 14:41
I very much enjoyed and appreciated your review, Revilod, as I am unfamiliar with this music. I find Amazon reviews can be very useful and my favourite reviewer is Scott Morrison who is very much a friend to "unsung composers". As Alan Howe says though, empty reviews can do more harm than good, I have read too many now to be swayed by "this is a masterpiece", which is a word used much too often and usually means a devoted but not very objective fan of that composer. Or in some reviewers, apparently, any unsung composer's music!! :)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Kriton on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 21:33
Quote from: eschiss1 on Monday 27 September 2010, 00:50
There's been several recordings of his wonderful piano quintet 'over the years', including a fine one in my opinion (by itself) on an Arabesque CD some years back... haven't heard others yet but not surprised if some are better still (for all that I esteem that one and I do.)
This is very true. I first got to know the work through the "fairly recent" DG recording with Pletnev which is, I agree with Alan, really good. My favourite, though, would have to be the one on EMI - a Lugano chamber music festival recording. The fiercest possible playing this music could receive, without losing its lyricism. Other recordings I have on Melodya and Brilliant aren't bad either (although the Melodya sound is as usual horrible, in my humble opinion), and I think I've only missed this Arabesque CD you've just brought up.

It must be hard, in this niche-section of the repertoire, to find "bad" recordings; usually musicians willing to tackle the quintet by Taneyev (and this goes for a lot of other unknown piano quintets as well, I think) have something interesting to "say" about this music, and play it accordingly convincingly.

By the way, I really like the piano quartet and trio as well, but the quintet to me is an absolute masterwork, to be placed next to the Schumann and Brahms quintets.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Thursday 30 September 2010, 03:31
Quote from: Kriton on Wednesday 29 September 2010, 21:33
Quote from: eschiss1 on Monday 27 September 2010, 00:50
There's been several recordings of his wonderful piano quintet 'over the years', including a fine one in my opinion (by itself) on an Arabesque CD some years back... haven't heard others yet but not surprised if some are better still (for all that I esteem that one and I do.)
This is very true. I first got to know the work through the "fairly recent" DG recording with Pletnev which is, I agree with Alan, really good. My favourite, though, would have to be the one on EMI - a Lugano chamber music festival recording. The fiercest possible playing this music could receive, without losing its lyricism. Other recordings I have on Melodya and Brilliant aren't bad either (although the Melodya sound is as usual horrible, in my humble opinion), and I think I've only missed this Arabesque CD you've just brought up.

It must be hard, in this niche-section of the repertoire, to find "bad" recordings; usually musicians willing to tackle the quintet by Taneyev (and this goes for a lot of other unknown piano quintets as well, I think) have something interesting to "say" about this music, and play it accordingly convincingly.

By the way, I really like the piano quartet and trio as well, but the quintet to me is an absolute masterwork, to be placed next to the Schumann and Brahms quintets.
Tangentially, to (Very very loosely) paraphrase John Wiser and some others re bad recordings of lesser-known music- don't I wish :) er, anyway, carry on, carry on...
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Kriton on Thursday 30 September 2010, 03:55
Quote from: eschiss1 on Thursday 30 September 2010, 03:31
Tangentially, to (Very very loosely) paraphrase John Wiser and some others re bad recordings of lesser-known music- don't I wish :) er, anyway, carry on, carry on...
You're really funny! 8)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Revilod on Thursday 07 October 2010, 10:28
Quote from: eschiss1 on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 04:28
Apparently there was also a recording by the Odeon Trio of Taneyev's piano trio (to distinguish it from his numerous string trios, I will write that out in full :) ) with one by Alexander Tcherpenin. Has anyone heard that recording?...
Eric
Yes. I've got that LP. It was made by RCA in 1977 and has never, I think, been transferred to CD.  Unlike in the DG recording, the exposition in the first movement is not repeated ...a  mistake given the scale of the scherzo. The performace is a fine one, though, as you might expect, the players play with less character than do the "Allstars". The first thing I noticed, however, was that it is recorded in a totally different acoustic. The sound is, perhaps, a little more detailed because the strings produce a far thinner tone as recorded and so do not overwhelm the piano as happens a little with the "Allstars". It's a good disc but the DG disc makes far more of an impact.

The Tcherepnin coupling is a miniature (its three movements together last a little over 7 minutes.) It's a not unattractive folky neo-Romantic piece.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Thursday 07 October 2010, 12:01
Quote from: Revilod on Thursday 07 October 2010, 10:28
Quote from: eschiss1 on Tuesday 28 September 2010, 04:28
Apparently there was also a recording by the Odeon Trio of Taneyev's piano trio (to distinguish it from his numerous string trios, I will write that out in full :) ) with one by Alexander Tcherpenin. Has anyone heard that recording?...
Eric
Yes. I've got that LP. It was made by RCA in 1977 and has never, I think, been transferred to CD.  Unlike in the DG recording, the exposition in the first movement is not repeated ...a  mistake given the scale of the scherzo. The performace is a fine one, though, as you might expect, the players play with less character than do the "Allstars". The first thing I noticed, however, was that it is recorded in a totally different acoustic. The sound is, perhaps, a little more detailed because the strings produce a far thinner tone as recorded and so do not overwhelm the piano as happens a little with the "Allstars". It's a good disc but the DG disc makes far more of an impact.

The Tcherepnin coupling is a miniature (its three movements together last a little over 7 minutes.) It's a not unattractive folky neo-Romantic piece.
Thanks. I think I had a recording they made of some Brahms trios (lost or broke the cassette, I think. Or drenched it. There's a story.) but wondered how they fared with the Taneyev... :)
Eric
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Peter1953 on Monday 18 October 2010, 06:59
How lucky we are that the first 3 symphonies exist and are released (Taneyev allowed only the 4th to be published). Symphony 1 (never performed in Taneyev's lifetime) has some themes, especially in both inner movements, which after listening keep stuck in my head for quite a long time.  All 4 symphonies are wonderful, to my ears typically Russian works.

The Piano Trio op. 22 (1908) and the Piano Quintet op. 30 (1911) belong to the most complicated chamber music in my collection.  I've listened to them four times, but cannot remember any theme. These works are not meant to be background music. I think to fully appreciate both modern (or very late Romantic) tonal, complex, rather academic but well-crafted works, you need to sit down, don't get disturbed, and just listen concentrated. Pletnev and his 'Allstar Ensemble' are good advocates for these works, coupled on the DG disc (TT 82:34, a record?).
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Hovite on Sunday 31 October 2010, 22:31
Quote from: Mark Thomas on Sunday 26 September 2010, 20:49Peter, both Chandos and Naxos now have CDs coupling the First and Third Symphonies

I have acquired both those discs, though so far I have only played the Naxos. I had not previously heard the 1st. Its most memorable feature is its almost Brucknerian coda, which doesn't quiet work, it just sounds over blown. For me, the 3rd, with its Scherzo and Intermezzo inner movements, sounds more like a suite than a symphony.  In the past I had been puzzled by the description of Taneyev as a Russian Brahms, but these symphonies did indeed strongly remind me of Brahms (though his chamber works rather than his symphonies). Although I am very pleased that these works have been recorded, they lack the greatness of the 4th, so perhaps Taneyev was right to leave them unpublished.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: chill319 on Monday 01 November 2010, 02:27
Quote... the 1st. Its most memorable feature is its almost Brucknerian coda, which doesn't quiet work, it just sounds over blown.
Bluster-wise, how would compare The Taneyev 1 coda to that of Tchaikovsky's 1, Hovite?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 01 November 2010, 12:23
I'm a little suspicious of Taneyev sym. 1 since the only score I was able to interloan was a piano reduction, and that was probably already edited - the full score even moreso of course. I suspect of the two symphonies on the Chandos and Naxos syms. 1 and 3 CDs only sym. 3 has arrived in a reasonably complete form (and I am making an assumption there!...) - I don't know how much intervention was required - and what was actually done (beyond what was required...) - to bring symphony no. 1 to playability.  For all I know a coda may have had to been added even before the piano score was created - I have really no clue at all. (Well, obviously... (hush!))
Eric
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Gareth Vaughan on Monday 01 November 2010, 16:27
My understanding was that the MS of No. 1 was in a Russian library in a complete state. So any editing would have been minimal.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 01 November 2010, 17:58
ah, my mistake, then... (so long as complete means readable :) but that's another story)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Ilja on Monday 01 November 2010, 21:37
I have a Russian recording of Symphonies 1 & 3, which must have been made prior to 1956, if the conductor's name is correct - so the complete ms should've been available for some time.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 01 November 2010, 23:18
Quote from: Ilja on Monday 01 November 2010, 21:37
I have a Russian recording of Symphonies 1 & 3, which must have been made prior to 1956, if the conductor's name is correct - so the complete ms should've been available for some time.
That's interesting indeed as I was almost positive they were completely unrecorded until the two recent ones. But then I thought the Naxos recording of Creston's first symphony was its premiere too until I learned of an LP of that work from the 1950s.  By now I should know better than to say "first", I even try to write "by" (by date x rather than date x, I mean) on IMSLP "first publication" and "first performance" fields unless I am pretty sure I know what i'm talking about :) ... but the temptation is strong...
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Ilja on Monday 01 November 2010, 23:56
This recording was made by the USSR State Symphony Orchestra and conducted by Kurt Eliasberg.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Tuesday 02 November 2010, 01:52
Quote from: Ilja on Monday 01 November 2010, 23:56
This recording was made by the USSR State Symphony Orchestra and conducted by Kurt Eliasberg.
A quick search of a few sources reveals a Karl Eliasberg who died in 1978 but very little if anything about this conductor... interesting.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Hovite on Tuesday 09 November 2010, 20:19
Quote from: chill319 on Monday 01 November 2010, 02:27Bluster-wise, how would compare The Taneyev 1 coda to that of Tchaikovsky's 1, Hovite?

Well, Taneyev is less noisy, but Winter Daydreams hangs together better. But really they are chalk and cheese. Taneyev doesn't sound like his master, and there is no reason why he should. After all, Kreisler doesn't sound like Bruckner.

In fairness to Taneyev, it should be pointed out that his Symphony No. 1 was written when he was just 18.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: FBerwald on Saturday 29 June 2013, 08:55
His Piano Concerto in E-flat Major is a beautiful work. Admitted, the work has many faults, the first movement is virtually monothematic yet Taneyev handles this in a masterly fashion.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Ilja on Sunday 30 June 2013, 08:51
There is an (artistically) somewhat more satisfying performance (although the sound quality is far from great) here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xEsI_mOysI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xEsI_mOysI)

The Allegro by itself would make a great Konzertstück.

Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Sunday 30 June 2013, 17:29
Any opinions by the way on the new continuing series of his complete string quartets on Naxos, the first I know of since that undertaken by the Taneev Quartet in Soviet days?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: giles.enders on Monday 01 July 2013, 09:48
Sadly his piano concerto was never completed.  Only the first two movements exist.  It is a shame that he should have devoted his time to completing his friend, Tchaikovsky's third piano concerto and not returning to his own.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: FBerwald on Monday 01 July 2013, 12:47
I completely agree Giles.... yet the completed 1 movement is a far better thing than fragments in sketches  etc.., which in the hands of the wrong people would lead to utter disasters like we saw with the Elgar PC.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: scarpia on Tuesday 09 July 2013, 21:00
Taneyev's opera The Oresteia is going to be staged at Bard College in upstate NY later this month.  I have the Belorussian State Opera recording - very rare. Got a great deal on it in a shop in Montreal. It's a wonderfully grand opera.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: chill319 on Wednesday 24 July 2013, 03:01
@Revilrod. I'm often disappointed at the paucity of UK reviews when I visit amazon.co.uk. (A surprising number of reviews there are borrowed from other countries' sites.) I've written a few reviews for the Amazon site "across the pond," often of items with no other reviews. Mine are personal effusions, nothing more. My hope is that perhaps through them someone may find a sympathetic wavelength.  (It's been discovered that when people sing together, their hearts tend to beat together.) It's true that Amazon reviews are four- or five-star affairs, more often than not. Objective? Hardly. In my book, that's a good thing insofar as most of us have our best insights in relation to things we like rather than things we don't. Accordingly, when it comes to effusions, the more the merrier, I say. I would encourage all UC members, especially non-U.S. members, not to hesitate to broadcast your subjective as well as scholarly responses via Amazon reviews.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Richard Moss on Wednesday 24 July 2013, 19:31
I have just acquired, via Amazon for just a few pounds, the Koch Light recording of the Suite de Concert Op 28 (plus his Canzona) arranged for cello instead of violin (and clarinet) respectively. 

Does anyone know whether Taneyev himself scored both versions or, if not, who transcribed which version? 

The booklet notes for both violin and cello versions of the 'Suite' singularly fail to mention the 'other' version!  IMSLP only refers to the violin version!

Any enlightenment appreciated

Richard
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Finn_McCool on Tuesday 30 July 2013, 22:59
I saw the opening night performace of Taneyev's "Oresteia" last Friday at Bard Summerscape festival and I thought it was phenomenal.  The cast, the direction, the lighting, the costumes and, yes the music and singing were all top-notch.  Mikhail Vekua as Orestes was very impressive, but running close behind were Olga Tolkmit as Elektra and Maria Litke as Cassandra. Highlights included several scene-setting spooky moments from the orchestra, Orestes' duet with Elektra, Cassandra's aria in the first act, Clytemnestra's "mad sene", Orestes' aria praising Apollo and yet another Orestes aria late in the opera.  The set and costumes were a surreal combination of Taneyev-era Russian influence, occasionally jarring modern touches and the other-worldly furies and gods.  I wan't sure how I was going to fare with the ancient Greek storyline, but Taneyev's version and Thaddeus Strassberger's innovative staging made everything compelling.  Act 2 was especially gripping.  It is a performance that I will be chewing on for a while. 




Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: petershott@btinternet.com on Tuesday 30 July 2013, 23:20
What a wonderful experience for you - and sadly, probably a once in a lifetime experience (unless you go to further performances in August!) Strange you praise some of the singers, and the production....but not a word on Botstein?

Any rumours at all about a possible commercial recording arising from this production? For some years it has been one of those operas of which a recording at least seems not inconceivable, and that someone might make it actual has been a fervent hope of mine.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Amphissa on Wednesday 31 July 2013, 04:00
I too am envious. This opera is so rarely performed that it qualifies as a unique experience. I've enjoyed the old LP recording, but an actual performance ..... Do you know if it was recorded at all, video or just audio? Colleges often make in-house recordings.

Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Finn_McCool on Wednesday 31 July 2013, 14:49
A woman who was staying in the same Bed and Breakfast told me that she didn't like Botstein's conducting with the American Symphony Orchestra, so I made a point of keeping tabs on him during the first act.  After that, I was caught up in the story and the music and did not pay him so much attention.  Frankly, I'm not sure what her beef is/was.  I have loved everything I've seen Botstein conduct at Bard.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: scottevan on Monday 05 August 2013, 05:17
I was at the final performance of "Oresteia," and though undeniably a bloody affair it did not disappoint. Singers (the lead roles imported from Russia,) chorus, orchestra (Bard Festival orchestra conducted by Leon Botstein) and direction (Thaddeus Strassberger) were, as expected, all top-notch.  Unlike many other opera stagings those directed by Strassberger almost never bog down; he keeps things interesting by involving the chorus and principals in stage business throughout, giving the already-compelling story a "full speed" momentum.

Tanayev's score is a lush combination of late German romanticism -- Wagner-like leitmotifs weave throughout the score -- and melodies that veer close to Russian folk (the choruses in particular) though they settle into a musical landscape that borders Anton Rubinstein and Tchaikovsky, a good friend of Tanayev's.

Greek-tragic-wise, it's fascinating to compare with two other operatic treatments of the tale, Berlioz's "Troyens" and, of course, Strauss's "Elektra."  Tanayev's version resides in some in-between place, in which both Cassandra (just *how* did she escape the fall of Troy?) and Elektra share the stage. In that role, I thought Olga Tolkmit gave the best performance, though Mikhail Vekua, as Orestes, was undeniably the (anti) hero of the day.

Though I am fond of the existing Melodiya LP's of this work, like others here I also hope this acclaimed performance gives impetus for a new recording. It will, by the way, be traveling to the Maryinsky Theater, so those still eager to see it can have their wish -- for the price of a ticket to Russia. ;)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: scarpia on Friday 09 August 2013, 16:29
I was there too. The tenor part sounded difficult to sing. I wonder if that's why it isn't done more often. It was quite a tasty treat, eh?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Amphissa on Saturday 10 August 2013, 10:03
How long was the entire performance? I'm curious what was cut from the original score. Or did they just use the performing score that is on the LPs?
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: scottevan on Sunday 11 August 2013, 02:47
It lasted a full three hours and forty minutes (including intermissions.)  Not that bad, when you consider that the classic trilogy of Aeschylus was boiled down to one night at the opera!

The program notes were very clear that this was the first "complete" performance of the opera outside of Russia. However, I wondered about its completeness myself when there was no evidence of the famous overture. I discovered later that Tanayev wrote the overture after the opera itself had been produced. I missed hearing it, but must admit that it would have made a long performance even longer!
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Ilja on Tuesday 13 August 2013, 08:35
The overture isn't really an overture in the usual sense, but more like a symphonic poem made up of themes and motifs from the opera.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Amphissa on Tuesday 13 August 2013, 08:46
The original suffered cuts at the hands of the Mariinsky Theater management, where it had premiered. Taneyev was angry about that, but there was nothing he could do about it.

So I wonder whether this was the cut version or the original version.

Either way, I would lover to hear it. My first hope is a DVD, but a CD or even a broadcast or in-house recording would do. It qualifies as a true rarity.

Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: scarpia on Wednesday 14 August 2013, 19:16
Youtube has a complete performance: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6gnEAtsUIs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6gnEAtsUIs)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: ewk on Friday 03 April 2020, 09:17
Knowing how old this thread is, I just wanted to Express how impressed I am by T's piano quintet and trio. I just discovered them yesterday and I was very much impressed. What a powerful finale of the quintet!
The funeral March of the piano concerto is very moving, although I don't like the 1st movement, either.
Apart from the mentioned 2 violins + viola trio op21, there is also the op31 trio for violin, viola and tenor violin/violotta. Very interesting for the use of Stoelzner's violotta, and while e.g. the Leopold trio's performance uses a cello transcription, this piece could be restored to its original sound using a Hutchins tenor violin. It would be very interesting to hear that.
Best wishes! Ewk
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Friday 03 April 2020, 11:36
... we haven't had a general thread about Taneyev in 7 years? The man deserves better. He was a wonderful composer, and there have been, in the last years (well, 2007 on anyway if not always 2013 on), iirc, some interesting first recordings- including that piano concerto (and the 1875 overture in D minor in the Naxos series might be a first recording- I'm trying to find evidence of an earlier one on LP or elsewhere :) ) - and not first but "it's not like the competition was thick on the ground" (Naxos' set of his string quartets (with the Carpe Diem quartet, 2011-16) and maybe only the 2nd or 3rd recording of his 1st & 3rd symphonies (ok, that one was issued way back around 2008), for example...) ...

Speaking of the concerto, this premiere broadcast (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDrabRfPcYU) looks interesting.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Finn_McCool on Monday 25 May 2020, 06:05
I was chuffed to see a performance of Oresteia from the 2013 Bard Festival in the downloads section; however,   I was unable to get it to download.  Has anyone else had any luck?  Has Bard been sharing video of its Summerscape operas?  I saw there was another more recent Bard performance listed in the download section as well.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: dhibbard on Monday 25 May 2020, 15:43
The Piano Concerto was the first ever recording of it... no prior recordings were released on LP as far as I have researched.  However, the score (which I have a copy of) had been in the market for a while.. published in Moscow in the early 80s. 
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Monday 25 May 2020, 21:09
"early 1980s"- 1957, even! See IMSLP (https://imslp.org/wiki/Piano_Concerto_in_E-flat_major_(Taneyev%2C_Sergey)) for publication info. (Of course, the score you have might be a later complete works publication; I don't know.)

The link I gave above was to its first performance (1998), I think, which was -not- commercially recorded. The Toccata CD was its first commercial recording, yes.

(edit: I should say, to the first public performance with orchestra in that form (orchestrated and completed by Vissarion Shebalin). Of course the two-piano version as edited by Pavel Lamm and published in 1953 and uploaded to IMSLP (PD-CA) as an urtext of sorts - has probably received some private performances- and maybe even a public one - for all I know, but not counting that. The orchestration/completion was published only four years after the publication of the 1953 publication, but did wait four decades for public performance- well, not unheard of.)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: Finn_McCool on Thursday 28 May 2020, 15:51
I am happy to report that after three days and 9 or 10 attempts, I was able to download the video of the Oresteia performance at Bard.  Coincidentally (or maybe not), I received an email from Bard the same day informing me that the Oresteia performance (as well as other performances) was now available to stream on Bard's Fisher Center "Upstreaming" page.  There was also an encouragement to make a contribution to Bard to offset the fact that their annual Summerscape festival has been postponed until next summer.
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: eschiss1 on Sunday 31 May 2020, 04:48
His output could be stylistically unpredictable (?)- the late (1910-11) trio with violotta that I'm listening to right now sounds in places like it was written exactly a century earlier (comparing parts with Beethoven's op.74 in texture, anyway.)
Title: Re: Sergey Ivanovich Taneyev (1856-1915)
Post by: dhibbard on Thursday 11 June 2020, 00:07
. (Of course, the score you have might be a later complete works publication; I don't know.)

Yes, just pulled it down from the bookshelf.. it is a later publication.   At the time the Soviet Union collapsed, there were hundreds of copies of various Soviet scores available in the market..... probably folks buying them for pennies and selling them to the various music shops.    I bought several scores in 1991.