"Oh Mighty Monster": the Rubinstein "Ocean" Symphony

[TerraEpon]

Other question -- is the Naxos recording the same as the Marco Polo (which I heard and found really boring)? I seem to remember it wasn't, and I'm too lazy to navigate the eternally slow Naxos website to check...
With all this praise, I'm tempted to give it another go if I can.

[Alan Howe]

It's the same recording. Unfortunately.

[eschiss1]

Naxosdirect is often faster and their links can also be found by a quick websearch. They're both the Gunzenhauser recording apparently, yes (I don't think I've heard it yet but expect I probably won't like it much myself, maybe until e.g. Hans Stadlmair, say, has a crack at it in the studio?.  Naxos has done new recordings of e.g. Szymanowski's symphonies (... all 4? I don't think so- I'm surprised if there's been two recordings out of the first, though Botstein conducted it in public..., apparently yes, Stryja and Wit have both recorded it for MP and Naxos respectively. I'll be... well, it is fun, but the other three, though, are genius, and his other works even better...erm... offtopic.) but I think most of their transfer series has been transfers, not new recordings.

[JimL]

As far as Shaw is concerned, the following exchange of missives with Churchill is one of my favorites:

S. to C: "Am having two tickets for the opening of my new play held for you at the box office.  Bring a friend, if you have one".

C. to S: "Can't make opening night.  Please reserve tickets for the second performance, if there is one."

[Alan Howe]

Excellent, Jim! BTW Shaw on Goetz:

<<"He [Goetz] has the charm of Schubert without his brainlessness, the refinement of Mendelssohn without his limitations and timid gentility, Schumann's sense of harmonic expression without his laboriousness, shortcomings, and dependence on external poetic stimulus; while as to unembarrassed mastery of the materials of music, showing itself in the Mozartean grace and expressiveness of his polyphony, he leaves all three of them simply nowhere. Brahms, who alone touches him in mere brute musical facility, is a dolt in comparison to him.">>

[Gareth Vaughan]

Nothing if not opinionated, Shaw was a preachy old thing and some of the speeches in his plays are remarkable for their length and (some would say) tediousness. In Mart Crowley's play, "The Boys in the Band", one of the characters dismisses Shaw with the camp remark: "...that Bernadette Shaw - talk, talk, talk!"

[Alan Howe]

Of course, he goes way over the top about Goetz. Nevertheless, hyperbole can sometimes be useful...

[DennisS]

Readers on this forum will know that I am a great admirer of Rubinstein's music generally and feel that he has been underated. Perhaps now his music is starting to gain the recognition it deserves. Although I rate his work highly, I accept that on occasion, themes are spun out and there can be longueurs, with also an element of being a bit samey.  Re - symphony no 2, "Ocean", acting on Mark's recommendation, I bought the original 4 movement version. I liked it a lot, especially the inspired writing for the woodwinds in the first movement. I then decided without being given any recommendation to purchase the 7 movement version, if for no other reason, out of curiosity - would it be more of what I like?? I have only recently received the latest disk and listened to it attentively. The answer is "yes", I do like it. It is though a little bit like 2 diffent symphonies. The original version works quite well and is very appealing. The revised version (revised twice) has a programme, the 7 movements corresponding loosely to the 7 seas but ,IMO, this is somewhat tenous as some of the movements don't seem to me to have much to do with water as such. I just ignore the programme and simply go with the music. I feel though that the added second movement does convey though the turbulence of the ocean quite effectively. Summing up, if I am pressed for time, I will listen to the original version. If I have more time, then I will listen to the revised version. Both work well for me.

Cheers
Dennis

[Alan Howe]

How about this performance on YouTube?>>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CagBYfUquU

Apologies if we've discussed this before - I haven't done a thorough search to find out.

[Christopher]

Was it REALLY called the "Ramsgate Symphony"?!

[Gareth Vaughan]

Of course not! That was Shaw being bitchy.