Stunning piano concerto openings

[thalbergmad]

When the Dreyschock first came out, I must admit my anticipation turned into disappointment. Althought i liked it, I was just expecting something spectacular. When i first heard the Concertstuck i thought it by far the superior work.

I look forward the Pixis. Perhaps an all Pixis disk with Les Trois Clochettes or the Grand Rondeau Hongrois.

I guess with a series as big as the Hyperion one, there are always going to be disappointments and what i do not like might well appeal to others. I won't go through the ones that did not appeal to me, but one was by a French composer.

Thal

[JimL]

I'll go to bat for Hiller 3 as well.  The 2nd is a fine work, but I actually consider the Espressivo to be a superior piece in many ways, and certainly, IMHO both late Hiller concertos surpass the Dreyschock Concerto in every respect.  Maybe even Hiller 1 too.

[Gareth Vaughan]

I too enjoyed the Dreyschock Concert Piece. It's melodically memorable and does not outstay its welcome, which the finale of the PC can be accused of doing. Incidentally, Frank Cooper (the pianist on the Genesis CD) took some entirely justifiable liberties with the Concert Piece (I think Dreyschock would have approved) and made it better than it is. He allocated a phrase on the piano to the clarinets at one point so that the two sets of instruments (piano and woodwind) have a little dialogue. He added some piano figurations to a tutti passage and the final cascade of broken octaves is entirely his - and entirely Dreyschockian. It makes me smile every time I hear it.
As to Pixis, it is likely that the concertino will accompany the Grand Concerto, but there will need to be something else as well to fill up the CD. I suspect Mike is thinking of the Hartknoch 2nd PC (No. 1 is lost) - if only we can find the full score or a set of parts.
Now I must stand up for Hiller, particularly the Concerto espressivo, since I located the score. A really beautiful and individual work, in my opinion. Not as flashy as Op, 69, but then it's not meant to be. I was a little underwhelmed when I saw the score first, but it has its own distinctive voice and grew on me very quickly - more so in Shelley's sensitive performance. Since I was also instrumental in finding the orchestral parts for No. 1, I have to say that I enjoy that work too, while not making any great claims for it.

[Peter1953]

Poor Alexander Dreyschock... But I like his opus 137. At this very moment I'm listening to his concerto again, and I really like it. Nice themes, some virtuoso passages, but not very profound, that's for sure (although the 2nd movement is absolutely lovely). However, coupled on a disc with Kullak's PC makes the Dreyschock concerto quite trivial, but then I consider the Kullak PC as one of the four best of the Hyperion series.
How lovely Dreyschock's Konzertstück must be! Maybe I feel sorry for Dreyschock because of all the criticism he received in his days, and later. I have the CD of Dreyschock's "Romantic piano music" by Michael Krücker (on the NCA label), which proves that Dreyschock is a fine composer.

Pixis? I'm very much looking forward to the release of any of his concertos. That must be quite something. See the thread on Johann Peter Pixis.

Ferdinand Hiller? I'm not that impressed, but I know I have to listen to his concertos 1 and 3 more often. I've just heard the double disc of piano music by Adrian Ruiz. But that's for another thread.

____________

Gareth, I'm very happy Hiller's 1st and 3rd PC are now recorded! His piano concertos are surely an important addition to the Romantic PC repertoire, and in my collection as well. Tomorrow I'll give the disc another spin.

[thalbergmad]

I can imagine the Hartknoch 2nd along with the Pixis. Nice cantabile moments and a brilliant rondo.

Thal

[thalbergmad]

Maybe I feel sorry for Dreyschock because of all the criticism he received in his days, and later. I have the CD of Dreyschock's "Romantic piano music" by Michael Krücker (on the NCA label), which proves that Dreyschock is a fine composer.

I feel sorry for him too. Regretfully, most people will only remember his name because of his mechanical stunts, but a study of his works reveal anything but a mindless mechanicus.

Thal

[Gareth Vaughan]

I agree. Dreyschock definitely deserves a better press. But it's the same old thing - prejudice. And then people sneer at him who have never heard a note of his music! Michael Krucker's CD is most enjoyable. I think, if one is to be fair, what weakend the PC is the lack of a sense of argument (by which I mean exchange of views) between the solo piano and the orchestra. The same criticism could be levelled at both the Concert Piece and the Rondo - Salut a Vienne. But Maurice Hinson thought that in the hands of the right pianist the PC would become "a minor masterpiece".

[thalbergmad]

One does come across a lot of prejudice on piano forums (i have been guilty myself). I don't mind people who criticise composers as long as they have at least listened to half a dozen of their works.

I will never forget someone who once claimed "Czerny wrote nothing but boring etudes" who had actually not listened to or played a single work.

Anyway, just finished listening the the Schytte concerto which has put me in a rather good mood. Stunning piece.

Thal

[TerraEpon]

Yeah, and I'm sure many people absolutely "hate Pachelbel's music", even though they've heard exactly one piece in arrangements unrelated to the original...
Or on the flip side love everything by x, when all they've heard are the popular pieces and not the other 400 pieces...

People are weird.

[peter_conole]

Hi all

Especially thalbergmad. A warm welcome. I share your passion for romantic concertos - piano, violin, cello...and yea, down to the euphonium and accordion when the crunch comes. Note: two accordion concertos were composed by W.B.Molique, an unsung to end all unsungs.

Re the original topic, I still find the openings of both the Brahms concertos hard to beat. Heard no 2 at a concert last night (Hamelin as pianist) and it confirmed a long held view. Among the unsungs, the opening of Raff's concerto is very striking. And as confessed in an earlier posting on this thread, I am very fond of have the winsome beginning of Hummel's late classical op 110.

One topic which has never really been considered in depth is what seems to have been the romantic piano concerto explosion of the 1830s, which I guess really began in Weber's hey-day, the 1820s. A lot of 'piano paganinis' seem to have been around. Why? Separate topic, I think.

regards
Peter

[FBerwald]

Well Hyperion is releasing Vol 48. Stenhammer Piano concertos in Nov. I Think the opening of the 1st in B-flat minor is very good. I already have a version on bis . Wonder what Vol. 50 will be !!!???

[jimmosk]

Allow me to plug the heck out of Eduard Kunneke's Piano Concerto No. 1 in A flat Major, op.36. Especially its opening, which is a thundering display for the soloist, only lightly punctuated by the orchestra.  Heck, here's its first two minutes to whet your appetite. Tiny Wirtz is the pianist with the  German Southwest Radio Orchestra under Wlodzmierz Kamirski on this KOCH disc.

http://jimmosk1.home.comcast.net/KunnekePCopening.mp3

-J

--
Jim Moskowitz
The Unknown Composers Page:  http://kith.org/jimmosk/TOC.html
My latest list of unusual classical CDs for auction:  http://tinyurl.com/527t7

[Gareth Vaughan]

Yes, the Kunneke is a superb work. But does anyone know his 2nd PC? I don't.

[Peter1953]

I don't think Künneke ever composed a 2nd piano concerto. It's interesting statement that Künneke, as a typical composer of opera's, operetta's and theatre music, also composed a few other works in a different genre. Why did he do that? Just for fun? An assignment? For a musical friend who likes to play a showpiece in a concert hall? Künneke obviously knew very well how to write for the piano, because it sounds anything but predictable, easy and boring.

Massenet immediately comes to my mind as another example, although less explicit than Künneke. Maybe something for another topic?

[DennisS]

Hello jimmosk/Gareth/Peter1953

Read with interest your comments on Kunneke PC. Listened to audio extracts. Very much liked what I heard. Decided to buy cd. Only source I found Amazon(co.uk/com/ca) but price absolutely ridiculous!!!! Seems cd no longer generally available - very disappointing! Will keep an eye out for the cd when I next visit some of the second hand shops in London. Thanks for alerting me to an interesting composer.
Cheers
Dennis