Not what it says on the tin

[Double-A]

How serious we all are on this topic!  Theater people do things like that routinely, play Hamlet in modern clothes, cut large sections of the plays etc. with no attribution (unless there is a copyright fee to be earned of course...).
Also, Fritz Kreisler (a candidate for this forum I believe) composed a concerto by Vivaldi, a Rondino by Beethoven, Preludium and Allegro by Pugnani etc.
Lighten up everybody!

[TerraEpon]

There's an interesting example of a 'suite' by Debussy
http://www.bis.se/index.php?op=album&aID=BIS-SACD-1782

In short, an orchestration of the rare intermezzo which was supposedly originally for cello and orchestra but only exists for cello and piano (it's also one of those cases mentioned in another thread about a piece being in a private collection for a long time). The rest of it is just orchestrations of other pieces.

[semloh]

Talking of getting back 'on topic', does anyone know of examples that are specifically in the realm of the romantic Unsung Composer?

[Alan Howe]

Lighten up everybody!

Fine, but in doing so let's keep to the topic...

[giles.enders]

I started this thread and the point I wished to make is that there is sometimes an implication that the music is almost entirely by the original composer and the completer has played a minor role, whereas they have done a great deal more than fifty percent.  In many cases, Elgar Symphony, Schubert symphonies, Mahler 10 and Howell's first piano concerto, I am pleased that some one has 'realised what is possible'  but I do object to fragments being used by others with the implication that the work is by the original composer.
To get back to the Granados, to imply that the second or third movements are what Granados might have composed is fanciful.  I like the disk for what it is, one movement by Granados and flights of fancy by another. 

At present I am trying to persuade a composer to complete some more piano concertos, which are a little more intact.

[sdtom]

Vaughn-Williams wrote his Sinfonia Antarctia first for the film Scott of the Antarctic and later created a concert version which made no mention of the film. It should have clearly stated that this material was adapted.

I don't agree at all. The Sinfonia Antarctica is not "a concert version" of Vaughan-Williams' (note spelling) music for the film "Scott of the Antarctic". VW uses the themes from the film to produce a genuinely symphonic work which is rightly included in the canon of his symphonies. Why should he say that he uses material from his film music here any more than stating he employs themes from his opera "The Pilgrim's Progress" in the 5th Symphony? I suppose a composer may do what he likes with his own work!

I used a poor choice of words and I've always had trouble with the 'a' in his name. I suspect that Vaughan-Williams knew he was going to create a symphony and did the film for money.

Getting back to the topic the recent recording on Sterling of Raff's Bernhard von Weimar music contains a long version of "Eine feste Burg"
Tom

[Mark Thomas]

Off topic, but I'll deal with it here. The Ein feste Burg Overture is not a "long version", Tom, but a rewriting of Raff's original Overture to Bernhard von Weimar, which amongst other things extended it by a few minutes, replacing the original's downbeat ending with a triumphal one. When the recording was made we thought that the BVW music (apart from the two posthumously published marches) was lost, and so substituted Ein feste Burg for the original Overture, but in the delay between recording and issue I tracked down not one, but two complete manuscripts! Heigh ho.

[sdtom]

Thanks for sharing this information with us. All of this CD is an important find.
Tom

[bulleid_pacific]

I used a poor choice of words and I've always had trouble with the 'a' in his name. I suspect that Vaughan-Williams knew he was going to create a symphony and did the film for money.

... and although trivial both of you seem to want to hyphenate his names  ...

Regarding the Elgar PC, the cover couldn't be clearer, I don't believe it does any damage to Elgar's reputation whatever and it's a guilty pleasure of mine too.  I don't need profound stuff all day every day...

[Gareth Vaughan]

Thanks for the correction. There should, of course, be no hyphen in Vaughan Williams. Let's be accurate. I'm glad you like the Elgar PC. I don't dislike it - I just don't think it's very good. Not really out of Sir Edward's top drawer IMHO.

[bulleid_pacific]

I absolutely agree that it's not great by any means and I'd also assert that the Elgar/Payne Symphony 3 is staggeringly good.  Seems like others would agree.  Even if the outcomes are variable, realisations / orchestrations / completions are sometimes wonderful.  But yes, the covers should tell the full story.

[Gareth Vaughan]

Yes, the Symphony No. 3 is top notch.

[bulleid_pacific]

To get back to the Granados, to imply that the second or third movements are what Granados might have composed is fanciful.  I like the disk for what it is, one movement by Granados and flights of fancy by another. 

Can't remember for certain offhand, but is it not the case that the Elgar 3 sketches were almost non-existant for the Finale?  I seem to remember Anthony Payne admitting that he's had to imagine Elgar's wishes far more here than in the other movements.  So the situation is far from clear-cut even in this celebrated example... 

[vicharris]

While always seemingly marked as arrangements or orchestrations, Mussorgsky's "Pictures at an Exhibition" has pleased me in almost any configuration, because the piano version alone towers above so much other music. My favorite is the Emile Naoumoff version, I see one by Leonhard Lawrence on YouTube. I wasn't too impressed the movements that Mestre added to the Granodos' 1st mvt (apparently with the most indications of what the author wanted). I also like the Elgar piano concerto for the most part for no particular reason. I guess sometimes I balk a little at people turning piano quintets, etc. into concertos, usually seem to fall a bit thin on the ears. For example, Brahms' Piano Quintet in F minor is, like the original "Pictures" on piano, more than just fine the way it is. All just my unschooled opinion, and I guess if this sort of thing is amusing to composers, they can do all they want, but I definitely agree that truth in advertising helps me accept such more open-mindedly.

[sdtom]

Somewhere I saw the hyphen and started using it. I also spell Lizst for some reason. Little things.

I recently received this recording http://www.musicweb-international.com/classrev/2015/Feb/Pictures_GEN15340.htm which is a brass delight if you like your music this way.
Tom